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#1 | ||
Bugger 'all Member...
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bashville (I mean Brisbane...)
Posts: 93
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Dear Gentlemen,
Just a quicky... With all of the recent Phase 4 frenzy that's been going on due to the auction, I thought it would be a good time to ask the following question: What hypothetical lap time(s) were the Ford Factory Racing Team predicting for the Phase 4 at Bathurst in 1972? I've never actually seen an answer to this one, either in print, or online in a forum. Many Thanks in advance! Sooty. |
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#2 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 478
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I think French managed 156mph in 1972 in his Bryan Byrt phase 3 with the globe alloy wheels that were destined for the phase 4. At a guess 160 or less I'd say
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#3 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 962
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Mid 2:03’s I heard!
Or does this belong in the P4 urban myths thread?
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Steve Current rides 2012 Mondeo Titanium wagon (TDCI) Moondust silver 2016 Focus Trend, 1.5ecoboost, 6sp manual. Frozen white Previous 2004 Berlina Wagon (LS1) Vespers Blue 1995 Camry 2.2, white 1971 Ford Fairmont wagon 302w, C4 Polar white 1971 TC Cortina, 2L 4sp, Ermine white |
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#4 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2005
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#5 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 962
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Quote:
Oh that's right! "The chase" wasn't in place then, I'd say mid 2:02's.... Sorry man, couldn'y find the "tongue-in-cheek" emoticon!!
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Steve Current rides 2012 Mondeo Titanium wagon (TDCI) Moondust silver 2016 Focus Trend, 1.5ecoboost, 6sp manual. Frozen white Previous 2004 Berlina Wagon (LS1) Vespers Blue 1995 Camry 2.2, white 1971 Ford Fairmont wagon 302w, C4 Polar white 1971 TC Cortina, 2L 4sp, Ermine white |
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#6 | |||
I'd rather be blown
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: wa
Posts: 928
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Quote:
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Curent rides: FG GT-Plastic fantastic ,416 RWKW tune only , Walbro 460 pump, king springs, Koni shocks, XA GT Coupe , too many mods to mention Previous rides: BFGT COBRA number 33, BAGT, BMW 535 E39 80 SERIES LANDCRUISER X2 XAGT 4 DOOR , XC COBRA, XYGT, XA GT COUPE , XYGT , HD Holden sedan, V6GT CAPRI converted to V8, MAZDA RX2. |
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#7 | ||
Ford screwed the Falcon
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,096
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Sub 2 minute lap.
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Falcon: 1960 - 2016 My cars Current ride 2016 FG X XR6 - 6 speed manual Previous rides 2009 FG XR6 - 6 speed auto 2006 BF MkII XT ESP - 6 speed auto 2003 BA XT V8 - 5 speed manual 1999 AU Forte - 5 speed manual 1997 EL Fairmont - 4 speed auto 1990 EAII Fairmont Ghia - 4 speed auto |
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#8 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Roxby Downs
Posts: 69
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Interesting to note that the hq holden lap record is 2.46 seconds- with the chase. Not bad for an old red 202 3 speed. Shows how a good tyre and suspe sion set up is important.
Sent from my SM-G928I using Tapatalk
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1997 el futura. 1978 P6 town car. 1975 xb coupe. 1963 morris. 1920 model T |
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#9 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Newcastle NSW
Posts: 7,890
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Sure. A V8 Supercar time from a leaf spring suspension car on cheese cutters
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T3 TL50 #147 Silhouette Auto ESS - Brembos - Last of 3 in T3 spec, only AUIII TL50 ever built -14.2 sec @ 98mph bog stock. Only customer ordered T3 TL50 built, only LWB sedan plated AUIII and the last performance enhanced LWB sedan built by Ford Aust. AUII Fairlane Ghia Sportsman 5.0L in Blue Pearl OWN THE ROAD |
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#10 | ||
Wirlankarra yanama
Join Date: May 2006
Location: God's Country
Posts: 2,103
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1972 - Alan Moffat Phase 3 - qualified @ 2:38.5
1973 - John Goss XA Hardtop aka Phase 4 - qualified @ 2:33.5 |
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#11 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,361
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Quote:
Taking those 2 things into account would make it unlikely than the Ph4 would've done a 2.33. It is interesting to look at the Ph1 vs Ph2 times. Geoghegan's pole in the 1969 Ph1 was quicker than Moffat's 1970 Ph2 pole time. As a matter of fact the 1970 race was slower in total time over 130 laps than the winning time of the old HT GTS350 in 1969. It should've been the reverse as the Ph2 (Cleveland) was more powerful than a Ph1 (Windsor) which was more power yet again than the 350 Monaro. Dr Terry |
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#12 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 962
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You don't think track condition plays a part do you, Dr Terry?
Interested in why you think the Coupe has better aero. I would have thought they would have been similar.
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Steve Current rides 2012 Mondeo Titanium wagon (TDCI) Moondust silver 2016 Focus Trend, 1.5ecoboost, 6sp manual. Frozen white Previous 2004 Berlina Wagon (LS1) Vespers Blue 1995 Camry 2.2, white 1971 Ford Fairmont wagon 302w, C4 Polar white 1971 TC Cortina, 2L 4sp, Ermine white |
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#13 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 169
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Quote:
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#14 | |||
Peter Car
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: geelong
Posts: 23,145
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Quote:
Need my memory refreshed, did the XA's run the 4 wheel discs or was that the XB? |
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#15 | |||
Bugger 'all Member...
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bashville (I mean Brisbane...)
Posts: 93
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In terms of the road cars Boss, I think it was just the Landau's to begin with, and the GT's didn't receive them until the XB.
But... with regard to the race cars, I think I might have read or heard that Marsden was able to use discs all-round in '73 on the basis of claiming that the Landau was a production variant of the GT... Quote:
I'm surprised however that none of the articles that have been written thus far have seemingly been able to extract an official "forecast" out of any of the leading factory team personalities who are still with us... Anyhow, thanks to all of you so far Gents, and Best Wishes for now, Sooty. |
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#16 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,361
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Quote:
The excuse they used at the time was that the Landau was an evolution of the GT so they could use them. Given that the Landau had only just been released (Aug '73) & they would not have built the 200 required & that the Landau had the 2V headed motor didn't seem to matter. The XB GT had rear discs, but they weren't released until after Bathurst that year. Dr Terry |
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#17 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Victoria
Posts: 7,854
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Whats the weight of the XY compared to the XA coupe?
Im thinking theres not much in it, but the coupes always looked so big & badass on the track
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#18 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 11,293
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Didn't 73 XA coupe also have bigger tires for Bathurst?
I remember something about oil surge problems... |
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#19 | |||
Bugger 'all Member...
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bashville (I mean Brisbane...)
Posts: 93
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Quote:
That cotton-pickin' Supercar Scare has got a lot to answer for... http://hardtophub.com.au/facts/' |
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#20 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,361
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Quote:
Dr Terry |
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#21 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 478
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The orange team car entered for Geoghegan lost its rear wheel exposing the disc brake setup at the Sandown 250.
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#22 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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#23 | ||||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 571
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Quote:
Quote:
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#24 | |||
Bugger 'all Member...
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bashville (I mean Brisbane...)
Posts: 93
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Quote:
But... If a gang of rowdy XU1 Fanboys happen to get you on the back foot over the matter, you could throw the following statistics at them: It appears that a total of 736 Hardtops of all types were made during that particular month, which - if spread out evenly over the 20 working days of that month - works out to a rate of about 26 of them per working-day, which happens to equal 130 hardtops over those crucial first 5 working days of the month, which when added to the 85 Landau's previously produced, would have been 15 more than the number required for homologation of the brakes, if they were all Landau's... (which is possible in Fan-land...) Anyhow, Best Wishes for now, Sooty. Last edited by Sooty; 25-10-2018 at 10:15 PM. |
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#25 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,361
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Quote:
I don't think it was just the early days either, the homologation of the XD's kerb weight was a bit iffy at best also. Dr Terry |
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#26 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 658
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Quote:
1971 - 2.38.9 1972 - 2.35.8 1973 - Group C 2.33.4 A series production HO4 i recon would have done a 2.34.8 maybe.... Althought.....Moffat only got a 2.34.5 in the modified XA GT coupe RPO83 works racecar. Last edited by TIC-302; 14-01-2019 at 12:08 PM. |
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#27 | |||
Ford screwed the Falcon
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,096
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Quote:
You didn't read the media reports that these cars were going to reach 200mph?
__________________
Falcon: 1960 - 2016 My cars Current ride 2016 FG X XR6 - 6 speed manual Previous rides 2009 FG XR6 - 6 speed auto 2006 BF MkII XT ESP - 6 speed auto 2003 BA XT V8 - 5 speed manual 1999 AU Forte - 5 speed manual 1997 EL Fairmont - 4 speed auto 1990 EAII Fairmont Ghia - 4 speed auto |
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#28 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Newcastle NSW
Posts: 7,890
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Even if they could ( on the Hay Plains maybe but at Bathurst I don't think so) it wouldn't equate to over 20 secs a lap to get it below 2 mins
__________________
T3 TL50 #147 Silhouette Auto ESS - Brembos - Last of 3 in T3 spec, only AUIII TL50 ever built -14.2 sec @ 98mph bog stock. Only customer ordered T3 TL50 built, only LWB sedan plated AUIII and the last performance enhanced LWB sedan built by Ford Aust. AUII Fairlane Ghia Sportsman 5.0L in Blue Pearl OWN THE ROAD |
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#29 | |||
Ford screwed the Falcon
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,096
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Quote:
My posts went straight over the top of your head. Most people on this forum realised I was taking the pis.
__________________
Falcon: 1960 - 2016 My cars Current ride 2016 FG X XR6 - 6 speed manual Previous rides 2009 FG XR6 - 6 speed auto 2006 BF MkII XT ESP - 6 speed auto 2003 BA XT V8 - 5 speed manual 1999 AU Forte - 5 speed manual 1997 EL Fairmont - 4 speed auto 1990 EAII Fairmont Ghia - 4 speed auto |
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