Petrol or Diesel Focus

[buggerlugs]

Trying to figure out is it worth spending the extra dollars on a Diesel Focus. Has to be an Auto. The claimed figure for the Diesel Auto is 5.4lt per 100 ks compared to 6.6lt for the Petrol auto. 20 to 25ks a year will be done. Opinions would be greatly appreciated................

[kevino]

As a diesel focus owner- at your indicated useage of 20000kms mileage I would suggest the petrol model.

Diesel is more expensive than petrol in SE Qld its $1.60 d v $1.50 petrol.

If you are doing surburban running the diesel will probably be at 7ltrs/1000kms vs (?) 8.8 for the petrol.

Maintenance is a higher cost on the diesel say on your mileage $250 a year.

So with the higher capital cost and higher maintenance cost your cost per km will be much cheaper with a petrol. the performance and handling on the petrol will better the diesel except at highway speed where the diesels torque is superb.

Having said that I guess you are talking an auto-the auto on the diesel is much stronger and reliable than the petrol auto-refer to other posts.

[hangfire]

get the diesel, it is much more torque'y and more fun to drive. the petrol is gutless

[kevino]

The diesel has very little off the line, it only gets going on gear 3/4/5/6.

[hangfire]

which is when the majority of driving is taking place...
overtaking, cornering etc.
the petrol finds hills tough, the diesel eats them with a trailer on the back
no contest

[spvd02]

Originally Posted by hangfire

get the diesel, it is much more torque'y and more fun to drive. the petrol is gutless

You obviously have no clue how the petrol drives.You just look at the torque figures on paper and make your judgement based on that (like most diesel owners do). Many diesel owners rave about the torque their engine produces, but its advantage only really shows when towing. Other than this, despite its high torque figure, it wouldn't hold a candle to the GDi.

The petrol is easily quicker, and almost as economical. It also happens to be a great drive. It's smooth, quiet and responsive, and would leave any diesel in its wake. There's no annoying 100km drives needed to clean filters, and petrol engines handle short trips far better (diesel fuel needs a lot of heat to run properly). The efficient dual-clutch auto (not to everyone's liking) makes the most of the petrol engine's power, and returns great economy in city driving (see sig.)

Diesels should be reserved for larger vehicles, where slower response isn't an issue, and where the extra torque is useful to shift the vehicle's weight effortlessly. These characteristics aren't necessary in small cars, where slow response becomes more of an annoyance. It's no wonder demand for small diesel powered vehicles is in decline.

[marg99]

Pity they moved to the new auto box in the petrol engines because that is most of the issues with them.

[mutanti]

I'm Very Happy with My Titanium Diesel Focus 2012...
Bit of Turbo lag in first but its fantastic overtaking and very nice to drive

[In Focus]

The Mrs recently bought a 2014 petrol. The auto is very smooth now, or at least compared to her previous 2010 Fiesta and, surprisingly, my car's VW DSG.

[kevino]

Originally Posted by spvd02

You obviously have no clue how the petrol drives.You just look at the torque figures on paper and make your judgement based on that (like most diesel owners do). Many diesel owners rave about the torque their engine produces, but its advantage only really shows when towing. Other than this, despite its high torque figure, it wouldn't hold a candle to the GDi.

The petrol is easily quicker, and almost as economical. It also happens to be a great drive. It's smooth, quiet and responsive, and would leave any diesel in its wake. There's no annoying 100km drives needed to clean filters, and petrol engines handle short trips far better (diesel fuel needs a lot of heat to run properly). The efficient dual-clutch auto (not to everyone's liking) makes the most of the petrol engine's power, and returns great economy in city driving (see sig.)

Diesels should be reserved for larger vehicles, where slower response isn't an issue, and where the extra torque is useful to shift the vehicle's weight effortlessly. These characteristics aren't necessary in small cars, where slow response becomes more of an annoyance. It's no wonder demand for small diesel powered vehicles is in decline.

Agree with most but at 80kms and more an hour on the highway or freeway the diesel is just effortless.
And if you are doing big kms a year I do 40000 the diesel is cheaper to run.

[DRU842]

Recently faced the same decision, with the additional requirement that I was looking to trade for a Mustang in 2-3 years. Discussed with various people & stuck with the petrol, as I was line ball on the fuel saving at 25,000km per annum and would recoup the extra cost of the diesel at resale time.

[Yellow_Festiva]

I would choose the oil burner, only because I had one in the past and when it was going good it was great.

The factory consumption figures are easy to match, they pull a load very well. Can leave it in 6th on the freeway and it will tackle any hill without dropping a gear..

The servicing is what gets you. If you decide to take it to a non Ford service centre it will be serviced for less than what Ford do the Petrol for.

I think the minor service on a Focus diesel is around the $315 under the 'Capped Price' program.

When I took mine to a Midas for a second opinion on a fault the guy told me they would do the minor logbook servicing for around the $180 mark.

Oh, thats right, that doesn't include the 'free' roadside assistance.....

My suggestion. Buy the diesel, shop around for the best discount you can if you are buying new. Tell them to shove their 'free' extended warranty up their clacker and kiss the dealer service centre good bye after your free 1500km tyre kick.

You will need to take it back at 60k for them to service the tranny, do that as a stand alone service and it will be around the $450-500 mark.

[Mulga]

There's lots of variables here i.e. are you doing short or long trips each day, stop start heavy traffic etc. You need to consider this as the DPF will not be happy with short trips each day as the DPF needs to super heat to burn off the soot, this is referred to as re-generation. It is my understand that this can only be achieved at higher speeds. I personally don't like diesels, mainly because of the carcinogenic emissions they produce. Each to their own!!!!

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Mulga

There's lots of variables here i.e. are you doing short or long trips each day, stop start heavy traffic etc. You need to consider this as the DPF will not be happy with short trips each day as the DPF needs to super heat to burn off the soot, this is referred to as re-generation. It is my understand that this can only be achieved at higher speeds. I personally don't like diesels, mainly because of the carcinogenic emissions they produce. Each to their own!!!!

Much debate about if these cars even have a DPF. I think the answer is still a negative on the Focus Diesel having a DPF.

[Franco Cozzo]

I know for sure mine doesn't have a DPF, if yours has a DPF it has a different intake pipe:

Non DPF equipped cars have a single rubber pipe going into the inlet.

DPF equipped cars have a 2 into 1 Y pipe going into the inlet.

Go to ignition is another way to check there will be a DPF light if it has one.

Mine is a series I LV, I'm not sure about series II ones.

Also in small cars, diesel always wins over petrol engines, all the NA 4 cylinder engines suck compared to their diesel counterparts in this category, petrol engines got no balls.

[Mulga]

Happy to be corrected, however I was under the impression that the LW Focus is fitted with a DFP, I'm sure the owners manual will determine if this is the case.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Mulga

Happy to be corrected, however I was under the impression that the LW Focus is fitted with a DFP, I'm sure the owners manual will determine if this is the case.

The owners manual. Mine told me the powershift is a 'sealed for life' type unit under normal conditions....

[spvd02]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I know for sure mine doesn't have a DPF, if yours has a DPF it has a different intake pipe:

Non DPF equipped cars have a single rubber pipe going into the inlet.

DPF equipped cars have a 2 into 1 Y pipe going into the inlet.

Go to ignition is another way to check there will be a DPF light if it has one.

Mine is a series I LV, I'm not sure about series II ones.

Also in small cars, diesel always wins over petrol engines, all the NA 4 cylinder engines suck compared to their diesel counterparts in this category, petrol engines got no balls.

Thanks for sharing your opinion. Remember, it's only an opinion, and that there might be people out there (like me), who disagree with you. My petrol LW Focus has plenty of power, and will out-pace your diesel, even if it doesn't feel like it. It needs to rev, but at least it doesn't mind revving, unlike the diesel alternative, where it feels like it's gonna go really hard, but then disappoints by running out of puff, forcing you to ram into the next gear to keep up the pace. Diesels feel strangled when trying to go hard.

[Franco Cozzo]

The difference is I can go 1750 RPM at 100km/h and still pull up a hill in 6th gear without having to drop back, I don't need to rev

[spvd02]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

The difference is I can go 1750 RPM at 100km/h and still pull up a hill in 6th gear without having to drop back, I don't need to rev

Yes - typical diesel characteristics = no bottom end (lag), stupendous amount of 'low-midrange', no midrange-top end. Not really a flexible or involving engine at all. It just goes (bit like a CVT). Pulls strongly, but is pretty boring.

[kevino]

Damo
There are petrol turbocharged engines developing their maximum torque at lower rpm.
VW 1.4 engine max torque around 1400 rpm.
Renault 1.2 max torque at 2000rpm.
Nissan /Renault 1.6 (in Pulsar SSS) 240nm torque at 2000rpm + 140kw.

The latest Wheels mag reckons next years updated Focus will have 1.5 turbo at 110kw and 130 kw settings turbo and no doubt max torque low down.

These engines give the benefits of diesel and the extra benefits of petrol ie clean revving.

That's the sort of engine I,m going to get in a car to replace my 2008 TDCI Focus which has just clocked up 160,000kms.

[hangfire]

i have owned the 1.8l petrol back in the uk
i tricked it out, replaced exhaust, lowered, retuned etc

the 2l diesel that i have is far more fun on a day to day basis

the petrol was great going around the isle of man (which is essentially an open race track) but i find the diesel more day to day useful and it is a lot of fun.
i havent had the urge to tamper with it as it is a cracker the way that it is.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by spvd02

Yes - typical diesel characteristics = no bottom end (lag), stupendous amount of 'low-midrange', no midrange-top end. Not really a flexible or involving engine at all. It just goes (bit like a CVT). Pulls strongly, but is pretty boring.

Which is where I do 99% of my driving, for something to just cruise around to and from work, its pretty good to be able to just ride a wave of torque easily.

I guess both have their benefits, but I like having not to rev out.

Originally Posted by hangfire

i have owned the 1.8l petrol back in the uk
i tricked it out, replaced exhaust, lowered, retuned etc

the 2l diesel that i have is far more fun on a day to day basis

the petrol was great going around the isle of man (which is essentially an open race track) but i find the diesel more day to day useful and it is a lot of fun.
i havent had the urge to tamper with it as it is a cracker the way that it is.

Mines got Bilstein shortened shocks all round, lowered 30mm and 22mm rear whiteline sway bar, and an Airtec Gen3 FMIC lol.

Originally Posted by kevino

Damo
There are petrol turbocharged engines developing their maximum torque at lower rpm.
VW 1.4 engine max torque around 1400 rpm.
Renault 1.2 max torque at 2000rpm.
Nissan /Renault 1.6 (in Pulsar SSS) 240nm torque at 2000rpm + 140kw.

The latest Wheels mag reckons next years updated Focus will have 1.5 turbo at 110kw and 130 kw settings turbo and no doubt max torque low down.

These engines give the benefits of diesel and the extra benefits of petrol ie clean revving.

That's the sort of engine I,m going to get in a car to replace my 2008 TDCI Focus which has just clocked up 160,000kms.

Its still fairly new technology at the moment, same torque figures as diesel or just all its torque available down low?

[buggerlugs]

Thanks for all the input. Was going to buy new but this http://www.manheim.com.au/passenger-...=SearchResults
came up. Might have a crack at it. Be like buying a demo.......

[spvd02]

Originally Posted by hangfire

i have owned the 1.8l petrol back in the uk
i tricked it out, replaced exhaust, lowered, retuned etc

the 2l diesel that i have is far more fun on a day to day basis

the petrol was great going around the isle of man (which is essentially an open race track) but i find the diesel more day to day useful and it is a lot of fun.
i havent had the urge to tamper with it as it is a cracker the way that it is.

1.8 or 1.6? Do they come out with a 1.8? If it's the 1.6, it's not all that powerful...

[kevino]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Which is where I do 99% of my driving, for something to just cruise around to and from work, its pretty good to be able to just ride a wave of torque easily.

I guess both have their benefits, but I like having not to rev out.



Mines got Bilstein shortened shocks all round, lowered 30mm and 22mm rear whiteline sway bar, and an Airtec Gen3 FMIC lol.



Its still fairly new technology at the moment, same torque figures as diesel or just all its torque available down low?

They are generally about 240nm of torque so as good as the Peugeot/Ford 1.6 HDI diesel which delivers 240nm and 270nm on overboost.

[spvd02]

Actually looked at some LW Focus Diesel videos on youtube, and they do go pretty well. Thought I'd easily beat one in my petrol Focus, but is probably a little closer than I thought.

As strong as the diesel is, though, I still like the idea of a responsive, efficient petrol engine with TI-VCT that still makes for effortless low-speed driving, even though its peak torque isn't that high. Definitely not ideal for towing, but pulls its own weight around nicely.

It wouldn't surprise me also if it matches the diesel for fuel economy on short trips from a cold start, considering it gets to operating temp very quickly. I'm assuming the diesel takes a while longer to warm up.

[kevino]

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Thanks for all the input. Was going to buy new but this http://www.manheim.com.au/passenger-...=SearchResults
came up. Might have a crack at it. Be like buying a demo.......

Yes if you can get this diesel at the right price you take away the cost disadvantages-looks like a nice bit of gear. Are these auctions at Eagle Farm?

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by spvd02

I'm assuming the diesel takes a while longer to warm up.

Yup... warm up time is measure with a sun dial....

[Jimtron]

We test drove both back to back and found the petrol very uninspiring. My wife said it was to slow for her.

While the diesel isn't a rocket, the torque delivery gives the impression of having a bit more go and makes it fun.

With your driving it's not likely to save you that much, maybe $500 per year in fuel costs. Our situation was much the same, but we liked it so we spent the extra on the diesel and are definitely happy with the choice.

My daily driver is a tuned XR6 Turbo, and I can get in the Focus and enjoy the drive.