One for the computer savvy...

HLC · 22-11-2006, 03:16 PM

Ok guys, i NEED a new computer for university.

I'm looking at getting a desktop PC. so i'll get one built up.

the trouble is, my knowledge of computers/hardware has somewhat declined over the last couple of years so im not really too sure on whats good, whats not these days.

basically i need something really top of the line. i will be doing A LOT of 3D modelling and Rendering, so i need a REALLY REALLY good graphics card. I'll also be running several of these modelling programs at the same time, like Rhino, Solid Edge, Auto CAD, 3DS Max etc as well as the obligatory photoshop and Illustrator.

i figured something like a 300gig harddrive would be needed and around 2 gig of ram. is DDR still current?

so basically i'm just asking if someone could maybe outline to me, what is some top of the range stuff that would give me a lightning fast computer with AMAZING graphics/capabilities.

i think Intel Core Duo's are the best processors? i've no idea.

so yeah, if someone could spec up a computer for me- that is everything. MoBo, processor, graphics card, a good sound card, RAM, HDD, all that i would be very very grateful.

cheers,
-Henri

**Professor Farnsworth** · 22-11-2006, 03:30 PM

Firstly i recommend MSY technology, they are the chapest reseller ANYWHERE in my experience in the industry. They have branches in NSW, and will make computers to order (but so will i if you like ;p )

Dual core processors are now the norm, with quad cores in full testing and partial release in some areas of the globe. My current system is a Core 2 Duo, which has some pretty slick capabilities. It's the e6600, which is stock at 2.4ghz, but i've overclocked it to 3.4+ with no issues whatsoever. The Core 2's run a LOT cooler than the previous models. It's also a relatively cheap CPU for what it does, and out-shoots AMD a fair amount at present.

I'm running a 7900GT video card, which is quick enough but if you want something potent, i suggest the ATI x1950xtx or something similar, as they are mammmoth cards. DDR is current, but it's now DDR2. PCI-E is the standard for graphics now with AGP almost gone.

For your needs i would suggest the following:

Intel "Conroe" Core 2 Duo (e6600)
mobo is up to you, but get something decent with firewire capability and expandibility, as some are very basic these days. Asus have some decent boards out at present, but make sure the board is "Conroe" capable, as a lot aren't yet.
ATI x1950xtx video (not cheap but awesome)
2gb+ DDR2 (run it dual channel for best results)
Western Digital "Caviar" 320gb HDD (x2 or x3) (i've never had an issue with WD, they're quiet and reliable)
Decent power supply & case (i run coolermaster and they're great)
Viewsonic or Phillips w/s LCD's are great too.

As far as soundcards go, most mobo's these days have pretty damn good integrated 5.1, 6.1 or 7.1 channel audio modules on them already. However if you want a separate card, you can't go wrong with SoundBlaster Audigy.

If you need any specific help feel free to drop me a pm. I'm pretty fussy with my systems, what i'm running at the moment is:

main machine
conroe e6600
2gb DDR2
2 x 250 & 1 x 320gb HDD's
Asus 7900GT (overclocked)
Coolermaster 600w silent PSU
Coolermaster Case
Logitech wireless kb & mouse
Viewsonic 19" W/S LCD

video editing machine
P4 "Prescott" 3.2e
1gb DDR
1 x 120, 1 x 200 & 1 x 320gb HDD's
XFX 6600 GT (overclocked)
Coolermaster 450w PSU
Some crap heap case
MS wireless inputs
Proview 19" W/S LCD

The video editing machine is an old system i beefed up a little, and isn't state of the art, but i have nothing else installed on it, other than the digital tv recording software, video editing software etc. It does pretty well too, so it proves you don't need to go all out if you don't want to.

cheers

chris.

janek · 22-11-2006, 03:46 PM

The biggest question is price. what price excluding monitor are you after?

22-11-2006, 03:50 PM

HLC, yeah MSY is the go, there in Auburn.

Basically what mrcrackers has said, but I'd go 2 hdds and go raid 1 just for a backup

**Professor Farnsworth** · 22-11-2006, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackLS

HLC, yeah MSY is the go, there in Auburn.

Basically what mrcrackers has said, but I'd go 2 hdds and go raid 1 just for a backup

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrcrackers

Western Digital "Caviar" 320gb HDD (x2 or x3) (i've never had an issue with WD, they're quiet and reliable)

i said x2 or x3 :P

loxxr6 · 22-11-2006, 03:58 PM

Notch up another vote for MSY.

Here might help too for parts http://www.staticice.com.au/ OR http://umart.net/au/

janek · 22-11-2006, 04:00 PM

Fluidtek @ carlingford/epping is also very good.

i got my 20" LCD from there for $280

HLC · 22-11-2006, 04:04 PM

i got a bloke in the computer industry, so thats covered, but if he cant help me i will be checking out MSY, considering i work at Auburn on fridays.

and Thanks Fantz errr mrcrackers (

: ), you seem to be on the ball. a bit went over my head, but it all seems to make sense.

in terms of budget. i dont want to blow like 3000-4000 dollars. BUT, i will pay whats its worth.

i cant have this thing slowing down on me in 6 months.

photn · 22-11-2006, 04:05 PM

same here MSY is the cheapest place.....

Personally for what you are doing id buy a Apple g5 desktop and select what you want. they have some pretty nifty features on them. www.apple.com.au if you wanted. other wise id be doing

AMD ATHLON X2 DUAL CORE 5000+
Motherboard = CrossFire™ Xpress 3200 for AM2
2 x 1 GB dual sided CORSAIR RAM
1 x 80 gig for all your software and stuff
2 x 120gig or a 200gb
that way your software is seperated from your data so if one blows you dont loose all of it in one go....same thing can be done with raid.

GFX there are a couple of options.

ATI Radeon x1950.
or the GeForce 8800 - there are GeForce ones with SLI technology which are supurb...

whatever else up to you

HLC · 22-11-2006, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by photn

same here MSY is the cheapest place.....

Personally for what you are doing id buy a Apple g5 desktop and select what you want. they have some pretty nifty features on them. www.apple.com.au if you wanted. other wise id be doing

AMD ATHLON X2 DUAL CORE
Motherboard = CrossFire™ Xpress 3200 for AM2
2 x 1 GB dual sided CORSAIR RAM
1 x 80 gig for all your software and stuff
2 x 120gig or a 200gb
that way your software is seperated from your data so if one blows you dont loose all of it in one go....same thing can be done with raid.

GFX there are a couple of options.

ATI Radeon x1950.
or the GeForce 8800 - there are GeForce ones with SLI technology which are supurb...

whatever else up to you

im avoiding Mac's as some of the software isnt able to be run on Macs.

**Professor Farnsworth** · 22-11-2006, 04:09 PM

as far as the budget goes, my system set me back about $1700, minus the monitor.

HLC · 22-11-2006, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrcrackers

as far as the budget goes, my system set me back about $1700, minus the monitor.

thats pretty good! ill get some quotes tomorrow or the next day. so see how i go!

S3SR · 22-11-2006, 06:59 PM

AMD 4600+ x2 (dual core)
ASUS A8N SLI PREMIUM - BEST s939 board EVER
x2 500gig SATA HDD seagate
1x pioneer 16x DL-DVD RW does DVD RAM as well
XFX 7600gt
1gig (2x 512mb) DDR500 kingston/kingmax hardcore ram should have got 2 gig (NO LONGER MADE )
Antec Plusview 1000 case (huge mofo inc about 4 fans)
Antec truepower 2.0 550w psu
Dual samsung 19" 's side by side ... a MUST for 3d modelling/autocad/solidworks not even a wide screen is good enough....i use those programs almost everyday for some work i do and dual screen makes life sooooo much easier
speakers - take a pic all cheap these days anyways (altec lansings or logitechs nothing else)
keyboard mouse - again ergonomics are crap, wireless are crap unless you spend 100's because some dont like more than 1 key pressed at once,
mouse - laser will seem very fast and may need adjusting to get used to, my logitech G7? or X7?? is the best i ever used

accessories
A3 printer - canon make one and its bloody good and fairly cheap
a3 scanner - sell your kidneys and maybe your heart as well
one of those touch screen mouse type things - fairly cheap a MUST for the modelling part and graphical side of things
floppy - whats that

most of that stuff i now own and its prob come to around the $2500 mark
$4000-5000 from upgrading/experimenting

tabletennisman · 22-11-2006, 09:55 PM

If the PC isn't used for gaming, I'd definitely go for a workstation graphics card such as ones from the nvidia quadro range. I'd probably look at getting at least an FX1300. A workstation card will carve up a gaming card especially with the 3D CAD work.

HLC · 22-11-2006, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tabletennisman

If the PC isn't used for gaming, I'd definitely go for a workstation graphics card such as ones from the nvidia quadro range. I'd probably look at getting at least an FX1300. A workstation card will carve up a gaming card especially with the 3D CAD work.

the only gaming i do is like Need for Speed and V8 supercars 3.

HLC · 12-02-2007, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrcrackers

Intel "Conroe" Core 2 Duo (e6600)
mobo is up to you, but get something decent with firewire capability and expandibility, as some are very basic these days. Asus have some decent boards out at present, but make sure the board is "Conroe" capable, as a lot aren't yet.
ATI x1950xtx video (not cheap but awesome)
2gb+ DDR2 (run it dual channel for best results)
Western Digital "Caviar" 320gb HDD (x2 or x3) (i've never had an issue with WD, they're quiet and reliable)
Decent power supply & case (i run coolermaster and they're great)
Viewsonic or Phillips w/s LCD's are great too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by photn

AMD ATHLON X2 DUAL CORE 5000+
Motherboard = CrossFire™ Xpress 3200 for AM2
2 x 1 GB dual sided CORSAIR RAM
1 x 80 gig for all your software and stuff
2 x 120gig or a 200gb
that way your software is seperated from your data so if one blows you dont loose all of it in one go....same thing can be done with raid.

GFX there are a couple of options.

ATI Radeon x1950.
or the GeForce 8800 - there are GeForce ones with SLI technology which are supurb...

Quote:

Originally Posted by FALCONSR

AMD 4600+ x2 (dual core)
ASUS A8N SLI PREMIUM - BEST s939 board EVER
x2 500gig SATA HDD seagate
1x pioneer 16x DL-DVD RW does DVD RAM as well
XFX 7600gt
1gig (2x 512mb) DDR500 kingston/kingmax hardcore ram should have got 2 gig (NO LONGER MADE )
Antec Plusview 1000 case (huge mofo inc about 4 fans)
Antec truepower 2.0 550w psu
Dual samsung 19" 's side by side ... a MUST for 3d modelling/autocad/solidworks not even a wide screen is good enough....i use those programs almost everyday for some work i do and dual screen makes life sooooo much easier
speakers - take a pic all cheap these days anyways (altec lansings or logitechs nothing else)
keyboard mouse - again ergonomics are crap, wireless are crap unless you spend 100's because some dont like more than 1 key pressed at once,
mouse - laser will seem very fast and may need adjusting to get used to, my logitech G7? or X7?? is the best i ever used

sorry for bumping the thread, but i am finally in a position to order a new PC...

now looking at these i have 2 suggestions for AMD and one for Intel...

which is better? (im assuming the 5000+ is better than the 4600+ AMD chip)

obviously 2 gig of ram is a neccssity, and 2 huge harddrives...

what about compatability with AMD processors? with programs, or does that not matter, whether its an Intel or AMD chip?

xrobx · 12-02-2007, 05:20 PM

The AMD 5000+ is the better processor out of the two.

2 Gigs of memory is becoming more and more normal these days, so yes.

AMD's processors (current) are 64bit, and thus allowing a 64bit compatible operating system on it. Though I wouldn't recommend it as finding drivers and software to work on the 64bit OS is a bit of a pain.

In most cases software isn't dependant on what CPU you have running, more so the operating system.

I have a PC for sale in the for sale section if you're interested. It's not new though, but still a decent system.

5tumpy · 12-02-2007, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HLC

im avoiding Mac's as some of the software isnt able to be run on Macs.

I wouldn't rule out a mac just because of that. The new intel processor ones are able to run both windows and Mac OSX.

My brother has a 24" Imac, and it shits all over anything else in the market. That's my 2 cents anyway...

superpursuit83 · 12-02-2007, 10:24 PM

Excuse me, but I too have been looking at an upgrade and can't really make any sense of it all.

I like the flight sims and have the new Microsoft FSX. It brings my computer to its knees at mid game settings. Some say you need dual 8800GTX cards?

I dont want to mess around any more and want to max the game out with dual monitors at 50fps.
But as always there is a budget and I could go to 4k if it did everything else as well.

Any ideas for a boilermaker

xrobx · 12-02-2007, 10:31 PM

That person wants you to spend your money.

Dual cards are more so a fad then anything else.

One single 8800GTX will be plenty enough to play FSX at it's full potential. However, processing the graphic image onto two screens can be a tough task. Two cards are obviously better than one. But realistically and thinking about your budget, it could be classed as over-kill.

If you have the money to burn, by all means, knock yourself out. However, in saying this, you will need an SLi compatible motherboard to run two cards. But if you don't feel like burning a hole in your wallet, just stick to one card.

S3SR · 12-02-2007, 11:40 PM

dude if you havent bought the machine yet get INTEL

go core 2 duo
2x 250gb SATA HDDs cheaper for your money
2gb DDR2 something like 900+mhz is still cheap $200ish for 1gb
mobo go Asus
video card - dual 7950gt's in SLI will give you ability to use 4 screens (perfect for those programs you use....and you wont go back) its better to go top of the line in one range (7000 series) than entry level in the next
8800gtx isnt value for money at something like $800+ thats 2 7950gt's

case is important for cooling get something big with heaps of fans and open area go antec
power supply is gonna need to be 550watt or bigger....go quality antec again

screen wise if you need the colours on the screen to match the end result there arnt many, thats all i can say

xrobx · 12-02-2007, 11:54 PM

Sorry to burst your bubble but the 8800GTX is top of the range. Even in the 8 series (until the 8900 comes out, which will be a while).

1 GB of memory at 900MHz will not be $200, defiantly more.

I prefer Silverstone Power Supplies, but that's just me. Antec still make some decent stuff (cases). I just had a bad experience with my Antec PSU.

Make sure you get a decent stable dual (at least) 12v rail model. My Silverstone is Quad 12v rail, it's tight as, very reliable and stable.

Mental · 12-02-2007, 11:57 PM

At the present, you CANNOT run dual monitors and SLI simultaneously.

For your intended application, CPU is going to be your biggest assett. Doing post/final renderings are going to kill you if you don't blow a decent part of your budget on something big and nasty. Second to that is Graphics, I highly agree that getting a workstation card like the Quadro is a very very good idea. And yes, playing games is going to be difficult, atleast it used to be. BUT there is/was a way of installing Geforce drivers with a quadro and being able to get acceptable game performance, it could be worth checking out.

I would also recommend that if you are going to be redering FMV scene's then keep your old pc for a rendering node, and while your at it, buy your mates old pc's and grow a farm =p they may only render 1 frame for every 5 of your main pc's but over a long scene, it all adds up!

I'm can't say how the new dual-core chips perform, I stopped caring after I built my current machine.

If you have the money, Get one of these (I have the previous version, skt940). Buy one dual-core opteron and populate the 2nd one later on. Only prob is that with one CPU you can only use 1/2 the ram slots and you loose a couple of the expansion slots.

pauljh74 · 13-02-2007, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by superpursuit83

Some say you need dual 8800GTX cards?

"The long and short of this experiment is that you need a high speed platform to get the most out of the new DX10 hardware. If you were planning on getting a $600 graphics card to replace your 1-year-old graphics card, it would behoove you to rebuild your box. Of course, this means that the whole graphics upgrade will cost you a lot more than just the graphics card.

If you don't do the job properly, the net effect will be like hooking up a pair of garbage speakers to a Bose or Klipsch sound system. The effect would be the same... less than optimal performance, and an experience that is far from ideal given the money you spent."
From: http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/11/...pu/page10.html

So dual GeForce 8800 GPUs would be a waste of money.

For a new system, Intel Core 2 Duo currently has the edge
Get 2GB of RAM, go to 4GB if you know your software will chew up more than 2GB easily. 2GB is very healthy normally
The ATi 1950 XTX or NVidia 7950GT are both very strong, but not ridiculously expensive cards
320GB Hard Drive is about the best value per GB currently
If you already have WinXP, you could give Vista a miss, otherwise it might pay to get Vista with a new PC.

HLC · 14-02-2007, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauljh74

For a new system, Intel Core 2 Duo currently has the edge
Get 2GB of RAM, go to 4GB if you know your software will chew up more than 2GB easily. 2GB is very healthy normally
The ATi 1950 XTX or NVidia 7950GT are both very strong, but not ridiculously expensive cards
320GB Hard Drive is about the best value per GB currently
If you already have WinXP, you could give Vista a miss, otherwise it might pay to get Vista with a new PC.

this makes the most sense to me... less jargon and clear cut answers

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