Fpv take notes from Big brother

my gt · 12-12-2008, 04:37 PM

http://www.fordperformance.com/

great site

flappist · 12-12-2008, 04:56 PM

Lots of nice stuff there. I suspect it would not work here as the there seems to be a "green grass" syndrome with Australian Ford buyers.

Most FPVs have povvo brakes and basic everything else with the "it is too expensive" mantra rumbling in the background.

The F6 R-Spec (the quickest best handling B series) was a flop and GTs outsell GT-Ps by lots despite being a superior vehicle (/me waits for the badge nazis).

If FPV were to offer for example a F6-P with a 350kw engine, all brembos and better suspension and bigger wheels/tyres WITH warranty for say and extra $25k, AFF would be full of threads of what a rip off it was as you can get a flash for $2.50 and "one tun chuck" brakes for $3.50 and woolies own brand wheels & tyres for $1.65 and do a 7 second 400m while getting 2.5l/100km doing a 20 second lap of bathurst.

And of course the BOSS/3V/T3/supercharged EA would be better, cheaper, shinier and hektiker.

It is amusing that whenever a new model is released there is a complaint that it is just a "stripe package". I wonder if that is because stripes are the SINGLY MOST ordered option by far.

XR6_661 · 12-12-2008, 05:04 PM

Ford US have always done that.

Look back to the old mustangs, you could option nearly everything on them from the base model 6 banger.

Good post flappist.

FPV8U · 12-12-2008, 05:17 PM

We really need a performance Arm for Aftermarket parts over here, Walkinshaw Performance Parts has shown that the concept works.

b2tf · 12-12-2008, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV8U

We really need a performance Arm for Aftermarket parts over here, Walkinshaw Performance Parts has shown that the concept works.

Has it? Ive seen maybe one Walkinshaw GTS around the place?

FPV8U · 12-12-2008, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Has it? Ive seen maybe one Walkinshaw GTS around the place?

While full Spec cars are few and far between, over on LS1 plenty of Shops are Flat out accross the country fitting walkinshaw bits and pieces.

Would be nice to have performance options that don't compromise warrenty on a brand new car.

4Vman · 12-12-2008, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV8U

While full Spec cars are few and far between, over on LS1 plenty of Shops are Flat out accross the country fitting walkinshaw bits and pieces.

Would be nice to have performance options that don't compromise warrenty on a brand new car.

You don't get a full factory warranty with Walkinshaw parts.....
You blow the motor or diff or box with a walky supercharger or exhaust and you pay for the fix yourself....

XRQTR · 12-12-2008, 07:09 PM

Ford U.S. an afford to warrant these mods bacause of the sheer volume of cars they sell, the percentage of people going to extremes in there mods is insignificant to the number of cars they actually sell.

It's also perception, if a company doesn't mind there cars being tampered with then it shows a confidence in the product on the part of the company against any major faults or issues. If Joe Average sees this he will assume that the cars must be put together quite well to be able to take such punishment. t

Tuth is that the "Approved After Market Suppliers" must ensure that there products will not harm the cars under these conditions. You'll find that the after market guys actually cover costs for any failure brought about by there products if it can be shown to be at fault.

FPV8U · 12-12-2008, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

You don't get a full factory warranty with Walkinshaw parts.....
You blow the motor or diff or box with a walky supercharger or exhaust and you pay for the fix yourself....

I had been told otherwise.. S/C i understand but exhaust..

4Vman · 12-12-2008, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV8U

I had been told otherwise.. S/C i understand but exhaust..

Sorry mate but if you modify your car it doesnt matter who does it, the Dealer will take the same line.....
Walkinshaws will also run in the other dirrection too..
If you mod it you wear the risks....

FPV8U · 12-12-2008, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Sorry mate but if you modify your car it doesnt matter who does it, the Dealer will take the same line.....
Walkinshaws will also run in the other dirrection too..
If you mod it you wear the risks....

Nah, i understand with for Example me taking a new XR8 to xxx Tune shop for Full Exhaust, but the way WPP was explained to me was like factory option performance parts.

4Vman · 12-12-2008, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV8U

Nah, i understand with for Example me taking a new XR8 to xxx Tune shop for Full Exhaust, but the way WPP was explained to me was like factory option performance parts.

Nope, nothing to do with Holden. They're a "closet" or separate autonomous division of HSV that has the "freedom" to operate outside of the normal constraints imposed on car manufacturers like ADR's and as a consequence Holden warranty and possibly RWC....
They're no different to any other aftermarket tuner, they just carry a "special" name to give it branding credibility.
Same deal applies, you mod your car and you take the risk.
The only thing Walkinshaw warrant is the parts they supply themselves, not the car, or the consequences of the use of those parts..
Holden are under no obligation what so ever to warrant any vehicle modified from std by them....

mik · 13-12-2008, 03:06 PM

probably not enough dollars to do it in big way down under for Ford, and not worth the headaches.

**Grunter** · 13-12-2008, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

...If FPV were to offer for example a F6-P with a 350kw engine, all brembos and better suspension and bigger wheels/tyres WITH warranty for say and extra $25k, ...

I would have been happy to pay some more coin for certain items, ala fully electric memory seats (I'm lazy), auto dimming mirror (very lazy) and 20" wheels (assuming they looked the part).

kocho · 13-12-2008, 06:03 PM

Yeah, great site Ford Performance. Pitty the 'Join the Crowd' rollover is wrong. What a basic, basic error.

Its actually a really poor site. :togo:

flappist · 13-12-2008, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grunter

I would have been happy to pay some more coin for certain items, ala fully electric memory seats (I'm lazy), auto dimming mirror (very lazy) and 20" wheels (assuming they looked the part).

You mean like a Force 6? Do you reckon it will sell??????

XRQTR · 14-12-2008, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

You mean like a Force 6? Do you reckon it will sell??????

Classic mistake, put a few "choice bits" on (there idea of what people want not what people want) and then hike the price.

What they need to do is have an entry level FPV and then allow buyers to "Up Spec" the car with whatever they can afford within the FPV range of products. If all you can afford is the $55K base model then so be it, but so many will go straight for the brakes and interior/wheel upgrades ala GT-P seats in an F6.

Ford and FPV need to look at companies like BMW, they are offering the new 1 series coupes with just about everything you need to turn it into a road registerable track weapon.

I mean yes it is the McD's approach of "would you like fries with that" but then again you really can't go wrong emulating a sales approach by one of the most succesfull companies in the entire world.

Yes and I'll have an apple pie and some cookies too thanks, take away............mmmmmmm and give me the 6 pack of nuggets

:

4Vman · 14-12-2008, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTR

Classic mistake, put a few "choice bits" on (there idea of what people want not what people want) and then hike the price.

What they need to do is have an entry level FPV and then allow buyers to "Up Spec" the car with whatever they can afford within the FPV range of products. If all you can afford is the $55K base model then so be it, but so many will go straight for the brakes and interior/wheel upgrades ala GT-P seats in an F6.

Ford and FPV need to look at companies like BMW, they are offering the new 1 series coupes with just about everything you need to turn it into a road registerable track weapon.

I mean yes it is the McD's approach of "would you like fries with that" but then again you really can't go wrong emulating a sales approach by one of the most succesfull companies in the entire world.

Yes and I'll have an apple pie and some cookies too thanks, take away............mmmmmmm and give me the 6 pack of nuggets

:

What island do you live on? everything you want is already available...

Pedro · 14-12-2008, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

...........If FPV were to offer for example a F6-P with a 350kw engine .........

They do now, There's plenty of posts around showing the FG F6's are pulling 280rwkw on various dynos, but Scrubby & co would have a field day if FPV were to admit it.

**Grunter** · 14-12-2008, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

What island do you live on? everything you want is already available...

I couldn't option the 2 items on my list that are in the Ford parts bin, so can you please point me to this island where FPV does option them.

smally289 · 14-12-2008, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

They're a "closet" or separate autonomous division of HSV

I always had my suspicions about this. Wonder when Uncle Tom will come out of the closet ........................

XRQTR · 14-12-2008, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

What island do you live on? everything you want is already available...

Australia, and you??

Show me an F6 with GT-P front seats from the factory or even the option list that I can order them on.

Rev28K · 14-12-2008, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

What island do you live on? everything you want is already available...

Some tasty options there on the 1 series, typical BMW they do charge a bit for options. But it is all covered by the BMW warranty.

http://www.caradvice.com.au/12020/bm...ormance-range/

In an ideal world with lots of $$ I'd go for the:
Sports steering wheel with integrated shift light
Lightweight wheels
Sports seats with harness cutouts and sidebags
Aluminium cross braces
Performance air intake
6 piston front calipers
Maybe the aero stuff (spoliers, diffusers and splitters)

BMW are in a bit of a weird spot at the moment. They don't want a tweaked 1 series to cut the M3's lunch. They probably wont do an M1 or 2, there is all the blather about a sub-Mpower Tii range. They have large global sales. Those sales have hit a nose dive of 30-40%.

I don't think that Ford Australia can do similar things. But if they could I'd have an XR6T with better brakes, much better seats (even the GTPs ones don't seem "that" great to me), dual zone A/C, lockable fuel cap and a stiffer suspension thanks.

FPV8U · 14-12-2008, 05:29 PM

Wouldn't mind something like that steering wheel for our cars, considering how FPR & FPV are cousins and all they don't seem to share asmuch racing DNA as we would like..

Bossxr8 · 14-12-2008, 09:42 PM

Easier for BMW to do that when they sell cars all over the globe, and have the expensive price tags to match. I remember hearing a while ago that a BMW 3 series costs as much as a Vectra to make, yet they charge nearly double for it, so they are generating massive profits from suckers who are paying for a badge.

my gt · 16-12-2008, 01:41 PM

the 5.4 mod engines are ending up in short wheel base F series trucks

FPV8U · 16-12-2008, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Easier for BMW to do that when they sell cars all over the globe, and have the expensive price tags to match. I remember hearing a while ago that a BMW 3 series costs as much as a Vectra to make, yet they charge nearly double for it, so they are generating massive profits from suckers who are paying for a badge.

Surely FPV could market a similar wheel for $1200-1500?

Hell, the "Sports" wheel, which is just an upgrade from a Taxi wheel is $700 and couldn't set them back a whole lot..

Bossxr8 · 17-12-2008, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV8U

Surely FPV could market a similar wheel for $1200-1500?

Hell, the "Sports" wheel, which is just an upgrade from a Taxi wheel is $700 and couldn't set them back a whole lot..

It all comes down to the numbers. They sell what, maybe 3000 FPV's a year?

Then you need to factor in how many they estimate would order the optional wheel. Maybe 1000 max?

Then factor in how much it would cost to design and manufacturer, and i'd assume it would need to be tested as well to ensure durability?

Then divide it all up and then they would know wether its financially viable or not. Its not as easy as it seems.

4Vman · 17-12-2008, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

It all comes down to the numbers. They sell what, maybe 3000 FPV's a year?

Then you need to factor in how many they estimate would order the optional wheel. Maybe 1000 max?

Then factor in how much it would cost to design and manufacturer, and i'd assume it would need to be tested as well to ensure durability?

Then divide it all up and then they would know wether its financially viable or not. Its not as easy as it seems.

Id say 5% at best, but who knows...?
That equates to what, 150 wheels, if it costs $100,000 to R+D a new wheel (electronics, airbag, crash testing etc) that's $666 at cost on the price just to cover R+D only... The wheel would probably retail for over $2K... i cant see too many takers just for a prettier steering wheel.

HSE2 · 17-12-2008, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

It all comes down to the numbers. They sell what, maybe 3000 FPV's a year?

Then you need to factor in how many they estimate would order the optional wheel. Maybe 1000 max?

Then factor in how much it would cost to design and manufacturer and I’d assume it would need to be tested as well to ensure durability?

Then divide it all up and then they would know whether it’s financially viable or not. It’s not as easy as it seems.

The GT-P has an issue and has had since BA Mk2. It’s not so much what such an item would cost but more about what are FPV going to do to justify their top tear models.

The money is out there. You introduce these features in top line models first and let them pay for the R and D then option them out.

FPV have been caught in no man’s land. They have to work at getting real difference into the interior that will make people want to spend the money OR they retract from that segment completely.

Once you get to 80 RRP you can’t continue on like FPV have been over the last few models. Those guys want a difference and will pay for it.