Future of Ford and Holden Could be Revealed in Detroit this week

[hendoau99]

i wouldn't mind if ford had a couple of cars based on the mustang. aslong as they keep a RWD falcon either, performance, luxury or base model. same goes with the falcon ute, as long as theres an xr of some sort and a tradie-spec ute.

[BroadyFord]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I dont think manufacturing here is at risk, more about what kind of Falcon will be built here.

So is it safe to dismiss this talk by these whacky journos about replacing Falcon with a rebadged Taurus AWD/FWD?

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by BroadyFord

So is it safe to dismiss this talk by these whacky journos about replacing Falcon with a rebadged Taurus AWD/FWD?

well Burela said this last year....

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mell...257750001FBFCD

[Road_Warrior]

Federal industry minister Senator Kim Carr said today he was optimistic about the future for the Broadmeadows assembly plant.

“I believe there will be a Falcon made here after 2016,” he said. “The substantive issue will be how much of it is made locally, and that is what we are talking through.”

There it is. Obviously with corporate engines, gearboxes and other systems the local content will drop.

[g220ba]

Here we go again for another year. The same people, the same stupid questions and the same rubbish articles materialised out of nothing.

I think i may just reserve judgement until Ford have something more official to say.

[vztrt]

I find it funny that FordUS has managed to trust Ford Australia on one of the most important vehicles in their stable (the ranger). Yet if you read the articles it would seem that a GRWD designed by Ford OZ is too big a risk.
Ranger is more important then a GRWD, in terms of sales, reputation and profit.

This isn't really making sense. As converting the Falcon into a FWD/AWD model would be a waste of money and you might as well just bring the Taurus here and maybe change the front and rear bumper to make it appeal to the masses. It would make more sense under one ford.

Creating a new GRWD chassis that can be used around the world would make more sense, be cheaper, allow more tech in the car, create a better chassis for the HiPo models and keep the Falcon RWD.

Mind you if Falcon does become an AWD model and isn't just a re-badged Taurus I'll give it a go. But not sure if I would part my money.

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

That article was written by Drive journalists, who penned the same crap and were the architects of the same hysteria last year.

Exactly. They are just trying to cover their backsides from last year, when they created huge hysteria but were then later made to look fools. Unfortunately, by that stage, nobody (mainstream media) was listening.

I also agree that this is damaging and blantantly untrue.

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

I too have to wonder at the logic behind spending $40M on Coyote, $120M on EcoBoost and LPI and however much it is for the FG update when the Falcon is supposedly a futureless car.

I mentioned the Coyote spend in the Boss S/C forum. They are only talking $36m investment for sales of 1500 per annum. If it is only 5years, that works out to be $4800/engine. Doesn't make sense.

Add the RWD Eco-Boost at $120m and these programs require more than just Falcon volumes for 5years.

[jpd80]

I might just add that the $120 million investment was for V6 Diesel in Terry, LILPG Falcon and EB I-4 Falcon.

The 40 million spent of FPV's S/C V8s is expected to be recouped inside the product cycle.

[Highway]

not this again.. or is this last years?

[ivorya]

Guys, don't shoot me but,

would it hurt Ford Aus to retire the Falcon nameplate?

With the dwindling sales, maybe a newer, smaller (Mondeo size) platform with a refreshed name might just be what the Dr ordered.

But hey, i just can't believe how many journo's want to kill off Ford Aus. It just seems they are all Holden hearted and they just can't wait to twist and turn words into negativity for Ford. It SUX!

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Worked for MMAL.

Falcon is not going FWD/AWD. It will be sharing a basic platform with Mustang. The I6 is dead, but we get to keep our RWD, Australian made Falcon.

Good to hear Paxton.

[Resurrection]

Originally Posted by EgoFG

I really do not think this is true.

What are you smoking?

[JPFS1]

mmmm... maybe..

[Gobes32]

Interesting, I personally would like an AWD Falcon but do not agree with the reporting going on here. Especially knowing that a Falcon chassis was sent to the US for engineers to evaluate. Apparently they have a lot of interest in Falcon's Control Blade IRS and it's ability to get the I6T and Miami V8's power down to the ground.......

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

mmmm... maybe..

Yes. Is my theory on page 2 close to the mark?

[tezxr8man]

Originally Posted by Brazen

There are some fantastic positives to the Falcon going to Taurus.


First of all, Falcon itself will be released as AWD only, with a range of EcoBoost engines, 8 weeks later a FWD Falcon will be launched with different looks and a different name solely for the Australian and New Zealand markets, lets call it 'Telstar'. It will be released powered only by the 2.0l EcoBoost, this new Telstar will be the same as the Falcon except with different front and rear fascias ala the Camry and Aurion. Its job is to protect the image by not associating the name Falcon with FWD, it will also be used to chase the government, fleet and rental buyers. This new Telstar will slaughter the normal petrol Camry's hold on this market, the Camry will turn to more Hybrid sales to offset the massive flow to this new Falcon derivative.

From above, the Falcons premium AWD and EcoBoost drivetrain will hit Holden right in the SS and Calais range, the Falcons superior set-up and image distance from fleet sales (thanks to Telstar) will give Ford the knock-out it needs. AWD and a larger 2.5 tonne towing capacity will also see traditional caravan and boat towing buyers return to the fold, the high tech image afforded by the latest features and gadgets available will see a big influx of import buyers especially lower end Merc, BMW, Lexus customers. FPV versions with V8 and AWD will be hailed as one of the best sports sedans on the planet.

The premium levels of Falcon will be exported globally in both FWD and AWD. Australia and New Zealand will be the only markets where you cant get a FWD Falcon (but you can get a FWD Telstar which is basically a Falcon anyway). Global sales will mean possible diesel and a wagon bodystyle returning.

I don't really agree with this, why would we want a camry competitor when we want cars to enjoy and be proud of i for one would not want a car to flog the camry in sales because it means ford has lost its soul and lost the will to make a great car to just make cars that sell
i do agree with the export idea tho but i think that ford are kidding themselves if they think that the Falcon hasn't got longer legs than just Australia, it would be great as a luxury car or even a large seller int the States or anywhere as it is with a fair bit of refinement at at great price

Ford seems to be the ones that are Killing the Falcon tho, they keep watering it down and watering it down, you want people to aim higher in the model range and when it looks just like the base model like the XR6 is now it doesn't work, they seem to be looking for excuses as to why it won't work.
The glass is half empty approach will never work

[irlewy86]

I guess they're just trying to double bluff the general, who feels confident that their FWD commo will be a hit

[mik]

yawn zZZZZZZZzzzzzz same old retoric, what ever happens we`ll have take it on the chin, but i`m not gonna lose any sleep over anything these same bunch of journo`s we`ve been listening to year after year bs`ing on.

[FPV GTHO]

I would seriously question if the local journos even care about the future of Falcon. They shouldve learnt from last year but it appears theyre just after blunt Q&A so they can print their doom and gloom.

[Windsor220]

Whether or not Falcon is going FWD or whatever, Falcon is finished in Australia. Sales are getting so poor now and the product isnt even bad. The media will kill off what hope it has. 380 all over again.

I remember last year a few guys I knew came up to me and said "Falcon is finished. I heard it on the news" I told them that the news misinterpreted what was said by Ford managment. These were guys that had a fair clue about the auto industry too. Ford is in an unwinnable battle it seems.

[kpcart]

to me it seems like ford is always too late with its releases compared to holden. then the general public think ford are just playing catchup all the time. the falcon has for many years had a good drivetrain, better then commodore, but holden comes out with better designs first. the vs commodore, then the vt, then ford shoots itself in the foot by releasing the AU to counter, a hideous car compared to the vt commodore. next they have to catch up again by rebuilding the au into the ba, while holden can just do simple design changes to the vy, vx, vz. then holden comes out with an absolute gem designwise, the VE, way before ford has an answer, and they sell it well, you read about it everywhere, you here how it was built to be structurally more rigid then a bmw 5 series, and then the FG came out, it just looked like a bad copy of the VE to most people, and ford cant get as good media coverage as holden, because they are hopeless at marketing. Ofcourse the Ford is a better car, better engine and gearbox, but you need more then that to sell a car, you need image and marketing. Ford will release a 4 cyl falcon, then maybe change to AWD, all that is not a problem if done well. there are great FWD big cars in the world. But they will not sell the car well as usual.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by FPV GTHO

I would seriously question if the local journos even care about the future of Falcon. They shouldve learnt from last year but it appears theyre just after blunt Q&A so they can print their doom and gloom.

I would also think that Ford Management be a little more careful on what comes out of their mouths. They should be smart enough to realise that ANY media will take a quote like that of J Mays and use it.

It is up to Ford now to respond without giving away their future production plans.

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by ivorya

Guys, don't shoot me but,

would it hurt Ford Aus to retire the Falcon nameplate?

With the dwindling sales, maybe a newer, smaller (Mondeo size) platform with a refreshed name might just be what the Dr ordered.

But hey, i just can't believe how many journo's want to kill off Ford Aus. It just seems they are all Holden hearted and they just can't wait to twist and turn words into negativity for Ford. It SUX!

Highly doubt it.

FordUS killed off the Taurus name plate only to bring it back due to how much of a silly idea that was.

Nissan are going to relaunch the Pulsar after it's Tiida replacement has been a failure.

However, Toyota replaced the successful Echo badge with the Yaris badge and has not looked back.. so it's an interesting point. Echo probably wasn't as important car clearly as some of these are, nor was it as long standing. Explains why when TMC asked TMCA to change the Corolla badge to the 'Auris' which is what it is known in many other countries TMCA told them to jam it.

[dannyhilton]

Originally Posted by SCUD

Nissan are going to relaunch the Pulsar after it's Tiida replacement has been a failure...Explains why when TMC asked TMCA to change the Corolla badge to the 'Auris' which is what it is known in many other countries TMCA told them to jam it.

The Tiida was an awful car, nothing could hide that, the Pulsar name meant more to consumers than the Nissan name did.

The Auris name change in Europe has helped Toyota claw some market share from the Focus, Golf and Astra. Like you mentioned, the Yaris name worked, the Insignia name change worked for Opel too where the Vectra was struggling. The trend here is these cars are all decent cars, and more importantly they are cars that consumers can relate to and desire. These cars were also marketed well.

Ford thought about changing the Fiesta nameplate to Verve, but realised they would be throwing away too much heritage plus the fact was the nameplate was still relevant and was working. The moral, when onto a good thing, don't change it.

IMO, the Falcon nameplate is still relevant and can be reinvented. If anything, it's the Ford nameplate in Australia that has been damaged.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by SCUD

Highly doubt it.

FordUS killed off the Taurus name plate only to bring it back due to how much of a silly idea that was.

Nissan are going to relaunch the Pulsar after it's Tiida replacement has been a failure.

However, Toyota replaced the successful Echo badge with the Yaris badge and has not looked back.. so it's an interesting point. Echo probably wasn't as important car clearly as some of these are, nor was it as long standing. Explains why when TMC asked TMCA to change the Corolla badge to the 'Auris' which is what it is known in many other countries TMCA told them to jam it.

I think people get too overly concerned with names.. Hyundai has changed all its models to “ixxxx”, Ford changed Laser to foucs & neither have never looked back. Tinda has not worked for Nissan because it is a crap car compared to the old Pulsar.. Bottom line, if the car itself is good & what the people want it will sell, the name is meaningless.. Do people honestly think any new large car Ford releases will sell any differently because it has or does not have a badge that says Falcon??

[Pistonbroke]

Herein lies the problem. There has been no official announcement, yet the hacks at goauto and carsguide on the front of their respective web sites have the story of the demise of the rear wheel Falcon.

You can't blame them in a way, in as much as a throw away line from some one high up the Ford ladder created this mess. These are Journos and need to write up stories. Its like a shark feeding frenzy. If you keep giving them bait they will just hang around till their satisfied.

I am a blue blood and don't want to see the Falcon just shrivel and die, and I don't want to see it transformed into a FWD puss box. If it is going to go, then hang up the nameplate. Falcon should always be synonymous with rear wheel drive and its racing heritage.

Taurus, hate the name. But I need a large car and would rather turn red than look at a large sedan FWD.

I find it annoying that they could bury the Falcon as it doesn't fit in the One Ford program yet they make the Mustang exempt. Mustang is 2 door and a niche market.

FFS give the Falcon some needed R&D for a global market and make it compatible for LHD and RHD. Even though the I6 is great, I think the future is the V6 so they can fine tune the chassis dynamics.

Families don't buy Mustangs. Personally, the taurus is like a camry.

I would rather look at a Commodore. Now that's sad...

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by Pistonbroke

...

I find it annoying that they could bury the Falcon as it doesn't fit in the One Ford program yet they make the Mustang exempt. Mustang is 2 door and a niche market.

How many mustangs sell each year compared to Falcon worldwide? Now tell me which is a niche market.

[Pistonbroke]

They sold about 72,000 mustangs last year. Then again they sold 500,000 F Trucks. So yes mustang is a niche market. My point being that with appropriate investment, Falcon could be turned into a global market car where the mustang will never reach mass appeal. It's really only an american (and Canadian) market where it competes with the camaro (which outsells it) and the Challenger.

As for exports you tell me. How many mustangs were sold outside north america?

[XRtowcar]

Agreed piston.
Falcon could have the oppotunity to be a economicly priced large car against the larger BM's and Merc's in Europe if given a chance.
Theres a lot more large cars in Europe then you would think.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by Pistonbroke

They sold about 72,000 mustangs last year. Then again they sold 500,000 F Trucks. So yes mustang is a niche market. My point being that with appropriate investment, Falcon could be turned into a global market car where the mustang will never reach mass appeal. It's really only an american (and Canadian) market where it competes with the camaro (which outsells it) and the Challenger.

As for exports you tell me. How many mustangs were sold outside north america?

My comment was in reference to you stating the Mustang was a niche market when in context of the Falcon.

I am not so sure the Falcon would be the top seller everyone thinks overseas.
It may sell a few here and there but we are a different market.