F6 vs R8

flappist · 27-10-2006, 06:55 PM

This is an interesting thread. A kiwi tested his F6 against a VE R8 on the pretext of potentially buying it and the results were not what the "true believers" hoped for.

In the land of the the blind a one eyed man would still drive a ls1......

http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=64108

Brute6 · 27-10-2006, 07:44 PM

Oh no, their precious new model couldn't be beaten by an older model Ford, could it? I guess thats your typical Holden enthusiast......

Full Spectrum · 27-10-2006, 07:47 PM

A Run in F6 againts a tight new demo car

.

XR6TickfordBoy · 27-10-2006, 07:49 PM

I love how all the following posts are just excuse after excuse. Accept defeat!

XR8-260 · 27-10-2006, 07:53 PM

As much as i love ford i doubt the F6 could beat a properly run-in R8. IMO a regular SS would give the F6 a good run if not better it.

Scott · 27-10-2006, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XR6TickfordBoy

I love how all the following posts are just excuse after excuse. Accept defeat!

Do you have ESP? I wish I could see the posts that would follow mine, I would start a thread on the Melbourne Cup!

Full Spectrum · 27-10-2006, 08:15 PM

I loved the mobile countdown

.
They probably did this but it's pretty shocking and i thought recording my 0-100 with voice was bad:P It's bad

.

Orbit · 27-10-2006, 08:19 PM

a run in R8 would have been a different story i think....well atleast iw ould have been a MUCH fairer comparison!

nugget378 · 27-10-2006, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlickHolden

A Run in F6 againts a tight new demo car

.

Hmmm,my engine made the most power when it was new,the more k's I put on it, it got progressively slower,this "tight" stuff is overated IMO...

Full Spectrum · 27-10-2006, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

Hmmm,my engine made the most power when it was new,the more k's I put on it, it got progressively slower,this "tight" stuff is overated IMO...

Your probably right with new cars.

BadMac · 27-10-2006, 08:33 PM

Guys to try and bring some independant comment to the discussion.

1/ Nobody can varify the claims so take the "tests" with a grain of salt.
2/ The R8 was brand new and I have driven a brand new one and they feel very tight, after 5k they are feeling good and I bet after 9k they aremaking real good power (I have also driven a brand new F6 and they also improve with mileage).
3/ We know nothing about the weather conditions, if its was cold and moist then the phoon would be at its best.
4/ We know nothing about the drivers and ther relative skills, swapping drivers and redoing the "tests" would at least have evened out any driving skill mismatch.

Remember Motors Figures. Back to back tests not somebody and his mate thrashing a brand new car.

Manual SS
0-100: 5.2
400m: 13.4@174.9

Compared to the Auto Typhoon.
0-100:5.4
400m: 13.5@175.1

SpoolMan · 27-10-2006, 08:34 PM

I was chatting to a mate of mine he is a member here (VX8255) and is a LS1 nut.
He recently drove a VE SS and said it felt sh#t, it didn’t inspire him at all.
The biggest problems was the lack get up and go when you kick the auto down it takes to long to accelerate, for now he will stick with his LS1.

XR8-260 · 27-10-2006, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpoolMan

I was chatting to a mate of mine he is a member here (VX8255) and is a LS1 nut.
He recently drove a VE SS and said it felt sh#t, it didn’t inspire him at all.
The biggest problems was the lack get up and go when you kick the auto down it takes to long to accelerate, for now he will stick with his LS1.

In wheels, the auto V8 calais ran a 13.9 sec 1/4 mile - only 0.1sec slower than the manual

M14A-Mclaren · 27-10-2006, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMac

We know nothing about the weather conditions, if its was cold and moist then the phoon would be at its best.

Since the test was done in NZ, there is a good chance it was.

4Vman · 27-10-2006, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

Hmmm,my engine made the most power when it was new,the more k's I put on it, it got progressively slower,this "tight" stuff is overated IMO...

VERY True, this "tight" stuff is just garbage, they make the most power when they're new, running an engine in takes an hour or 2 tops, the rest is slowely down hill...

WILDTRAKPX2 · 27-10-2006, 09:23 PM

We won't have to wait long for a "proper" comparison. I'll be putting my money on the Clubsport.

BadMac · 27-10-2006, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

VERY True, this "tight" stuff is just garbage, they make the most power when they're new, running an engine in takes an hour or 2 tops, the rest is slowely down hill...

Rubbish, valves need to seat, bearings and cranks need to bed and get a good oil film built up. Tolerances adjust themselves, why do you think blue printing can get you better performance.

I have seen dyno graphs of engines and their power increases with hours for a while, then as you say it slowly drops away. I have also read many comments from LS2 owners (VZ HSV's) that their cars seem to grow another leg past 10,000km and one of the performance shops did some testing and found power definately peaked after 10,000km on a standard (unmodified) car.

By the way, I used to build engine dynos and their control systems for a few years, so have some experience in running engines on dynos and their charateristics.

BadMac · 27-10-2006, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shockwave XR8

We won't have to wait long for a "proper" comparison. I'll be putting my money on the Clubsport.

I have seen one test of GTS versus F6 and nobody would take your bet.

The real test for me is if any mags can match or better the claimed 4.98 0-100. So far the only figure I have seen was 5.35 from NZ Autocar, but it was done on a corse chip road and they wheel spun it for first 2 gears, so hardly a benchmark (which is what they said).

NC 5ltr · 27-10-2006, 09:33 PM

Would of thought they would run there engines on an open dyno first up(engine not in the car) to loosen the engine a bit!!!!

regardless,the phoon will always win in in-gear acceleration.

MrSparkle · 27-10-2006, 09:37 PM

Wow, I feel stupider just from reading both this and the LS1 thread. Go figure.

27-10-2006, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMac

Rubbish, valves need to seat, bearings and cranks need to bed and get a good oil film built up. Tolerances adjust themselves, why do you think blue printing can get you better performance.

I have seen dyno graphs of engines and their power increases with hours for a while, then as you say it slowly drops away. I have also read many comments from LS2 owners (VZ HSV's) that their cars seem to grow another leg past 10,000km and one of the performance shops did some testing and found power definately peaked after 10,000km on a standard (unmodified) car.

By the way, I used to build engine dynos and their control systems for a few years, so have some experience in running engines on dynos and their charateristics.

Spot on there

: .4Vman an engine over time needs to be run in to perform it's best.If you take the right approach in running in an engine it will perform better than one that has just been neglected or incorrectly bedded in.I don't believe a motor is run in after a few runs around the block.

AUIII XR8 MAN · 27-10-2006, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shockwave XR8

We won't have to wait long for a "proper" comparison. I'll be putting my money on the Clubsport.

Agreed

4Vman · 27-10-2006, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THOR

Spot on there

: .4Vman an engine over time needs to be run in to perform it's best.If you take the right approach in running in an engine it will perform better than one that has just been neglected or incorrectly bedded in.I don't believe a motor is run in after a few runs around the block.

New engines or correctly built engines are built to "running" tollerences from day one... Ive seen engines do 3/4hr dyno work to run in the cam and tune it then hit the race track.
Modern day engines are no different, they're built to running tollerences, baby them and they'll be lemons.

gmkila · 27-10-2006, 10:21 PM

who cares which one is quicker if u want to find out for yourself go test drive one of each it's very easy to do

XR8-260 · 27-10-2006, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmkila

who cares which one is quicker if u want to find out for yourself go test drive one of each it's very easy to do

I wanted to test drive an AUIII XR8 to see how it compared to my BA and the sales person looked at my 18yo face and made up some bull crap excuse to not let me drive it. He mentioned somthing about insurance policies etc which is Bullcrap...

TZENU · 27-10-2006, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

New engines or correctly built engines are built to "running" tollerences from day one... Ive seen engines do 3/4hr dyno work to run in the cam and tune it then hit the race track.
Modern day engines are no different, they're built to running tollerences, baby them and they'll be lemons.

Well put! Couldnt agree with you more on that one!

Uni · 27-10-2006, 10:45 PM

R8 all the way. sorry folks, but the VE in raw performance terms is simply a better car, no doubt about it. the fact this test was so unscientific is [1] Hardly suprising and [2] almost entirely irrelevant. in raw numbers the R8 is better, and in sheer engineering and practical terms, it makes sense that it is the better of the two cars. Don't get me wrong, the Typhoon is on a fast track to cult status, along with its skinnier XR6T cousin, but the R8 is still the better car.

having sat in both today, i'd still take the Typhoon because the VE has possibly the worst interior i've ever experienced (dark, drab, it didnt even bloody work properly, i couldnt find anything, the ergonomics didnt suit me etc) BUT on sheer dynamic and performance terms, R8>Typhoon

Uni/.

27-10-2006, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

New engines or correctly built engines are built to "running" tollerences from day one... Ive seen engines do 3/4hr dyno work to run in the cam and tune it then hit the race track.
Modern day engines are no different, they're built to running tollerences, baby them and they'll be lemons.

Who said too baby them, an engine must be loaded up correctly in a set time frame to get the optuim performance and also one must remember a street engine run in correctly will run more efficiently.When you are reffering to race engines they are specifically built with loose clearances in mind,these may give you great performance out of the box but will not last as long as an engine with tight clearances.I have seen BOSS engines actually perform better with initial wear,Clevelands also may show better results with age aswell .Why does a new engine consume some oil in it's initial running in period???????It all depends on what you call running in or thrashing an engine that might differentiate our opinions.

Scott · 27-10-2006, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Modern day engines are no different, they're built to running tollerences, baby them and they'll be lemons.

Yep, get in and smack that nasty b!tch. I've always found that spankin my cars from new leaves me with an above average performer.

MITCHAY · 27-10-2006, 11:03 PM

I would never flog a new car. I'd follow the run in procedure as recommended

Don't plan on buying a new car anytime soon anyways so I don't have to worry.