Broad Band Manifold..what are your thoughts?

[Stav]

Yep..I bought one and it is in pieces.For performance usage I must say that it has lot that can be improved. Like my cylinder head there a moulding dags everywhere and casting mismatches which block airflow in the short runners.

The other observaton I have made is the fact of the 3800rpm cut in and the effectiveness of the short runners.If the air is flowing from the long runners and the short runners are activated then the momentum of air must create a negative pressure and momentarily kill power until air flow gets into the short runner and the car goes faster.

[JoesAu]

ive looked at it a bit too, the latest thing on bbm's i saw one guy on fordmods cut the butterflies in half not sure what affect that has?

[EL__Monty]

Originally Posted by Stav

Yep..I bought one and it is in pieces.For performance usage I must say that it has lot that can be improved. Like my cylinder head there a moulding dags everywhere and casting mismatches which block airflow in the short runners.

The other observaton I have made is the fact of the 3800rpm cut in and the effectiveness of the short runners.If the air is flowing from the long runners and the short runners are activated then the momentum of air must create a negative pressure and momentarily kill power until air flow gets into the short runner and the car goes faster.

Have you thought about going back to a log inlet manifold of an EA-ED. The ED manifold has a slightly larger internal bore diameter then the others? The ED XR6 produced similar power figures as the EF/EL XR6.

[Stav]

nar..for now I am going to stick to the bbm as it is 2 manifolds on one.More to test..more to learn.

Cutting the butterflies in half would make the drivabiltiy go poorer. In effect low to mid range power would be significantly less . At least hes trying. I think what I would like most is what I wanted from 4 years ago when the wagon got its first mods.The fattest power first and then topend power if it can.

[EL__Monty]

Originally Posted by Stav

nar..for now I am going to stick to the bbm as it is 2 manifolds on one.More to test..more to learn.

Cutting the butterflies in half would make the drivabiltiy go poorer. In effect low to mid range power would be significantly less . At least hes trying. I think what I would like most is what I wanted from 4 years ago when the wagon got its first mods.The fattest power first and then topend power if it can.

On my EL BBM I have a screw shaft on the BBM actuator that you can adjust which will leave the butterflies partially open on the short runners under 3800rpm. It's a similar setup like on the throttle body idle screw. So you could just keep adjusting the thread until you get the best performance.

[Road Games]

On my BA , there is a butterfly stop that once you bend it up 45degrees the lower butterflies are shut completely....topend becomes just that !! :evil3:

I suggested this to a few B-Series guys and got the usual knockers , one even started a war trying to discredit me with a sponsor i didn,t like at the time.

While i was banned ?? :

So : blllaaahhhhh : sucks to be him, because I did the mod, I have the quickest and Fastest BA XR6 4spd Auto in Queensland , and i will keep my future ideas to PM ....or to who ever visits me ....:evil3:

Go hard STAV , between the Two of us we are gonna break new ground !! :

[Stav]

I looked at the stop mod.You have to bend it to a certain degree.Bear in mind that the angle of the short runner port is angled.

[Stav]

I am gonna work out how to make the bbm give me a hard hit of ram type power.

[Mechan1k]

I have heard and seen good results with the older log type manifold being used as well. Especially when the internals have been bored smooth.

I know what you are talking about with the 3800rpm changeover that is noticeable ... I have seen many a dyno sheet with a momentary drop-off/plateau in power when it switches over at 3800rpm.

[Sox]

When I was going through the mods on my XH, the more mods which were made, the less the drop off became at changeover.
In fact, when I reached over 165rwkw, the drop in power was totally gone.

I like the BBM design, yes it can be improved, but only with cleaning up of the runners, pretty much like most other good manifolds.

I wouldn't mess with changeover points, or butterfly angles, as they are very good standard.

The only manifold which would outperform the BBM is a individual butterfly system, and even then you would sacrifice some power down low.
But up higher, look out, power would improve somewhat.

The log manifold is ok up top, but not really any better than the BBM, and power down low is significantly down.

Rick.

[Falcon Coupe]

Originally Posted by Stav

I am gonna work out how to make the bbm give me a hard hit of ram type power.

It sounds like you need a shot of gas, it's the only thing that will hit hard enough to actually feel.

[EvilChief]

stav: quick idea if u wanna toy with the BBM setup:

buy a cheap cheap shift light, wire it in in the engine bay, use a relay and now use the shift light to trigger the relay. relay output to negative and hook that into the negative trigger for the BBM control valve behind the washer bottle top passenger corner (there is a red wire, which is constant power and a diff thinner wire which is the trigger).

now by setting rpm point for shift light, you can adjust the opening of the BBM manually. i am using that system with my Haltech installs, excpet i use the PWM outputs with shift lite setup.

now you can adjust your opening to suit ur intake and camshaft design.

cheers
mic

[Road Games]

Originally Posted by EvilChief

stav: quick idea if u wanna toy with the BBM setup:

buy a cheap cheap shift light, wire it in in the engine bay, use a relay and now use the shift light to trigger the relay. relay output to negative and hook that into the negative trigger for the BBM control valve behind the washer bottle top passenger corner (there is a red wire, which is constant power and a diff thinner wire which is the trigger).

now by setting rpm point for shift light, you can adjust the opening of the BBM manually. i am using that system with my Haltech installs, excpet i use the PWM outputs with shift lite setup.

now you can adjust your opening to suit ur intake and camshaft design.

cheers
mic

Give this man some scones......What a remarkable idea, pity i havn,t got a clue about those electrics ..... :
Come on Stav PM is your friend mate .. :

[Stav]

I was thinking of installing an old xb choke cable to it and play with it manually.Once I find the sweet spot I will cut the computer control wire for the bbm.The I will use relays and an rpm switch to trigger it.I think the haltech can run a few realys so this might make it easier. Imho I think the bbm openning may possibly benefit from different opening timing for our modified fords. This can only be verified by real life testing ..preferbly at the track.
For a long time now I believed the timing of the bbm switch over point will benefit a modified ford. I want to run the car again after a few 2 dollar mods and then get my modified manifold in for another run a few months later...but dam time goes past fast so I better get moving.

Edit...if the bbm actuation is by negative trigger then it will be very easy to do for me..Thanks for the idea. Ive seen alot of bbm threads but I am going to make this one the best I can.

I really dont like the look or design of the log manifolds as I belive they will not be near as good as a stock manifold for daily driving and take alot from low to mid range power

[Stav]

Originally Posted by Falcon Coupe

It sounds like you need a shot of gas, it's the only thing that will hit hard enough to actually feel.

Not true mate..I have been playing with the bbm for a few months now and can say that the wagon is faster than my 14.241 run for now. I think there is more to come from the humble bbm ..

[EvilChief]

Originally Posted by Stav

I was thinking of installing an old xb choke cable to it and play with it manually.Once I find the sweet spot I will cut the computer control wire for the bbm.The I will use relays and an rpm switch to trigger it.I think the haltech can run a few realys so this might make it easier. Imho I think the bbm openning may possibly benefit from different opening timing for our modified fords. This can only be verified by real life testing ..preferbly at the track.
For a long time now I believed the timing of the bbm switch over point will benefit a modified ford. I want to run the car again after a few 2 dollar mods and then get my modified manifold in for another run a few months later...but dam time goes past fast so I better get moving.

Edit...if the bbm actuation is by negative trigger then it will be very easy to do for me..Thanks for the idea. Ive seen alot of bbm threads but I am going to make this one the best I can.

I really dont like the look or design of the log manifolds as I belive they will not be near as good as a stock manifold for daily driving and take alot from low to mid range power

from memory the interceptors do not support pwm outputs, maybe a cheap shift light amature from jaycar will do teh trick fine too.

as for manifold design, i agree with you, the BBM manifold was specifically designed for torque ad flow increase and ford did spend quite some time and money on its design to perfect it over the years.

[Stav]

You may be right about the haltech but I am going to ask the question.. If it has a latched negative pulse Ill be sweet.Actually I have the program on this computer ..might open it up and have a look

[Stav]

I just had a look.It has an rpm switch output which is programmable via one of the four digital outputs. It also has an rpm on input and a desired rpm turnoff I think this may be it!! I can also drive an extra injector,waterspray,boost control ..I like this unit..heheh

[Road Games]

Yep i second the water spray , fog it into the T.B, extra oxygen / MORE power LESS detonation ....win win Stav :

[Stav]

Originally Posted by DAZZLER351

Yep i second the water spray , fog it into the T.B, extra oxygen / MORE power LESS detonation ....win win Stav :

heheh..your a top bloke!! If you think about it..people run water injection shouldnt be necessary on a properly setup and tuned car.

[Road Games]

Originally Posted by Stav

heheh..your a top bloke!! If you think about it..people run water injection shouldnt be necessary on a properly setup and tuned car.

Very true , but humour me when you are at the track again........
One wiper hose into the vaccuum hose hole or drill one (3/16ths will do) of the intake pipe........Plug it afterwards .
Use it in top gear only and be sure to blank off the other hose or the officialls wont take kindly to you spraying water all over the track ...... :

Edit: 2nd gear might be useful as well, just dont hydraulic the motor.....Hope i didnt just give too much away .... :

[Stav]

Ah yes the dreaded hydralock in the engine can go off like a bang!!Just needs water hehe.. Man you havent given too much away as I have already investgated that too..heheh

[EvilChief]

hydralock: how much u wanna inject?

[Road Games]

Originally Posted by EvilChief

hydralock: how much u wanna inject?

Just enough , i have found ice packs on the fuel rail (for sprain injuries) tend to make the car more consistant as well......
I removed the 3 x bracings from manifold to head so i get one neatly either side of the T.B..
THEN Coles frozen peas around the Throttle Body

Not practical for everyday but it produces the numbers when required ? :evil3:

Now the secrets out ...................

[Stav]

Soxx youre right.bending the tab and opening the throttle body hole at the bore makes the car go slower. Dont reccomend it.Since trying it out for a week odd now the car goes like a dead dog.

[EL__Monty]

there is a ported BBM on EBAY for sale Stav;
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Ford-falcon-p...QQcmdZViewItem

[Stav]

Im porting one in my computer room right now champ..Also shifting manually got me one of my slowest times in ages..heheh.Im exploding a few myths here.. Btw I havent tried your bbm mod mate. I bent the stopper to straighten the butterflies.It is going back to the standard position.

[Stav]

Today I reset the bbm to standard angle..throttle response has gone nuts. That confirms the stopper mod doesnt work.

[Road Games]

Originally Posted by Stav

Today I reset the bbm to standard angle..throttle response has gone nuts. That confirms the stopper mod doesnt work.

Yep it doesn,t work on your AU Stav , and if every one believes it doesn,t work on BA's then i will be very happy ........
STILL No 1 in QLD !!!

[Stav]

Did you ever think that you changed something else at the same time that made you think it was the stopper.?