|
Welcome to the Australian Ford Forums forum. You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and inserts advertising. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features without post based advertising banners. Registration is simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today! If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us. Please Note: All new registrations go through a manual approval queue to keep spammers out. This is checked twice each day so there will be a delay before your registration is activated. |
|
The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
19-07-2009, 06:21 PM | #91 | ||
Dan Brown Photography
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Banksia
Posts: 1,544
|
does anyone know a genuine (yeah i know this is very rare) local member of parliment that is on our side to fight toe to toe with us on this?
__________________
the ford is gone. long live the ford 2023 Subaru Outback XT Sport, the turbo version TSU TSU TSU [/COLOR] |
||
19-07-2009, 06:39 PM | #92 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 14,654
|
Quote:
A young driver looses control of a 5 star ancap DSC equipped Falcon and slams into a pole killing all 3 occupants, 1 of which is only 17, an investigation reveals the car had lowered/modified suspension, one of the parents of a young occupant decides the driver was at fault and launches a million dollar civil action against the drivers estate, during the investigation they discover the car was modified outside of the tolerances of the OEM's design and rendered it outside of its ancap 5 star DSC/ safety calibration.... The case grows legs and gets ugly, the suspension company that modified the car get dragged in as a third party of interest... Impossible you say? If McDonalds can be sued (and loose) for coffee that's too hot anythings possible... We are becoming more and more litigious by the day.. Im not saying its right, but we all need to think carefully before going overboard with modifications in this day and age..
__________________
335 S/C GT: The new KING of Australian made performance cars.. Last edited by 4Vman; 19-07-2009 at 06:46 PM. |
|||
19-07-2009, 06:50 PM | #93 | |||
Former BTIKD
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Sunny Downtown Wagga Wagga. NSW.
Posts: 53,197
|
Quote:
__________________
Dying at your job is natures way of saying that you're in the wrong line of work.
|
|||
19-07-2009, 07:00 PM | #94 | |||||
Captain Malcolm Reynolds
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 3,830
|
Quote:
http://www.lectlaw.com/files/cur78.htm
__________________
Currently: 2014 Mazda6 GT (Daily) and 1999 Mazda MX5 (Fun Car) Previously: 2001 Ford Escape XLT; 2010 MC Mondeo; 1984 FD LTD; 2001 AU2 Falcon Forte; 2005 LS Focus Zetec; 1988 RE Colt; 1982 RB Colt; 1974 KE20 Corolla Quote:
Quote:
|
|||||
19-07-2009, 07:05 PM | #95 | ||
Miami Pilot
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ACT
Posts: 21,703
|
Uniform legislation has been under review fior around 10 years, and is soon to actually be made public (actually, pretty sure it is open for discussion now). Looks like NSW is going to be first to implement.
Regardless, 50mm is heaps to play with. XR to SL is only around 10 to 15mm, SL to SSL about the same, and XT to XR is around 30mm, so most Fords (and other brands) cars can go to SL no worries at all. In fact, I find anything lower than that is totally uncomfortable, bouncy and dangerous. As for 4WD, my understanding is that 2" lift is automatic approval, and up to 4" lift is approved after inspection etc . Anything higher would be problematic. Lowering a car does not make it handle better; shocks, spring rate, torsional stiffness, swaybars etc make the car handle. Ride height is just ride height. So why do we all lower our cars? Because it looks good, and for some it is in the belief that lower handles better - as T3man has already said in this thread, 90% of the time it doesn't. Yes, it may corner better due to lower Centre of gravity and less body roll, but on undulating tarmac, it handles worse.
__________________
-----------------------------------------------------------------
The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT |
||
19-07-2009, 07:09 PM | #96 | |||
IWCMOGTVM Club Supporter.
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Sydney
Posts: 891
|
Quote:
Even IF the car was not lowered more than the 2 inches [mentioned] , I think the company that made the springs could prove there was no detrimental effect to "safe" handling. If it was EXCESSIVE...3-4 inches or more...then well; would the onus not fall on the modifier? The company that made the springs (and most do) put disclaimers on their products stating "For Off Road Use Only" or words to that effect. But I agree, food for thought for sure.
__________________
Toys: 2017.5 LZ Focus RS, Magnetic Grey my new pocket rocket 2008 BF2 RTV Ute 1993 EB2 S-XR8 Sedan, Platinum, manual (now sold) 1975 XB Fairmont GS Sedan, Tropic Gold...or Starlight Blue...not sure yet...(SOLD) Last edited by platinumXR; 19-07-2009 at 07:14 PM. |
|||
19-07-2009, 07:09 PM | #97 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 14,654
|
Quote:
__________________
335 S/C GT: The new KING of Australian made performance cars.. |
|||
19-07-2009, 07:15 PM | #98 | |||
IWCMOGTVM Club Supporter.
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Sydney
Posts: 891
|
Quote:
__________________
Toys: 2017.5 LZ Focus RS, Magnetic Grey my new pocket rocket 2008 BF2 RTV Ute 1993 EB2 S-XR8 Sedan, Platinum, manual (now sold) 1975 XB Fairmont GS Sedan, Tropic Gold...or Starlight Blue...not sure yet...(SOLD) |
|||
19-07-2009, 07:19 PM | #99 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 2,146
|
I have actually heard from a senior member of our local RTA, this rule will apply to newer cars only, with things like ESP, stability control and all the electronic help. Older cars would still be fine. But this is coming from a third person, so again how reliable it is, I don't know. Will know more on Monday.
|
||
19-07-2009, 07:25 PM | #100 | |||
Former BTIKD
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Sunny Downtown Wagga Wagga. NSW.
Posts: 53,197
|
Quote:
__________________
Dying at your job is natures way of saying that you're in the wrong line of work.
|
|||
20-07-2009, 11:48 AM | #101 | |||
He has, the Knack..
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 1,042
|
The official word
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registrati...-july-2009.pdf Quote:
__________________
2010 BF MKIII Falcon wagon "EGO" Workhorse, stock as a rock 2004 BA MKI Futura - Now the wife's For Show: 18" Kaotic Shadow Chrome, King SL all round, Cadence Amp, Kenwood 12" Sub, JL Audio 5x7's, Scuff Plates, MP3 Connector For Go: SVI LPG, K&N Filter, F6 CAI, XR6T snorkle, XR8 catback, Magnaflow metal cat, Pacemaker headers, Underdrive, Thermostat, Custom tune, DBA4000 Now with baby seat and toys 175.6 rwkw www.bseries.com.au/King_Nothing |
|||
20-07-2009, 12:53 PM | #102 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Central Vic
Posts: 165
|
This kind of rubbish is getting worse.
Where are any stats or figures on accidents caused by lowered cars?? You would think these kind of statistics would be well known or available to the public if this problem is as bad as this clown is saying it is. I'd seriously like for any person that knows to post up some figures.
__________________
Currently own XB 351 Sedan XE ESP 302 69 Mustang Convertible XA 351 Coupe 1965 Galaxie Convertible 2005 GT-P AU XR6 Ute |
||
20-07-2009, 01:28 PM | #103 | ||
Petro-sexual
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,527
|
I wonder how they are going to deal with cars that have sports suspension as an option.
Eg. you buy a second hand car that didnt have sports suspension optioned, but you go and have it fitted. The car is now modified from how it left the factory but is within manufacturers specifications. I read the last line as "any car presented for blue slip after august 1 will need the aforementioned documents." I really hope for you NSW peeps that it is not the case, and previously modified cars will somehow be exempt. No Idea how they will work that though. |
||
20-07-2009, 02:04 PM | #104 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Wagga Wagga
Posts: 2,507
|
Quote:
I am really considering buying a bfII xr6 and NOT TOUCHING A THING.. The amount of laws and regulations that is coming out these days is taking the fun out of modifying a car.. I enjoyed fitting and improving the car, now im scared that every HP car driving around is out to get me!
__________________
Daily: AU Forte Wagon Project: AU Fairmont - Wants to be turbo The Family Car: 2009 G6E Turbo Future fun: 1968 Ford Galaxie 500 |
|||
20-07-2009, 02:08 PM | #105 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 618
|
Quote:
so i was right previously man puts lowered springs in man books app for inspection rta wedged with req man has to wait several months for inspection man drives with lowered springs man gets pulled over and has argument constable plod man waives booking in face of mr plod man goes into rta rta says lowering is legal man drives car man gets pulled over by mr plod mr plod defects car on "suspicion" of extra lowering being done after rta approval........... repeat cycle change man for woman if you so wish. going to be very hard to police............ clubsport springs in a base model commodore gt springs in a base model falcon ralliart springs in a base lancer...... etc etc all are factory......and how the hell do you tell if a ferrari, porsche or maserati have been lowered? they already sit on the ground!! |
|||
20-07-2009, 03:01 PM | #106 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
|
Oh no they are all out to get you....
Two points here: 1) This only applies to vehicles registered in NSW. If you have a Vic/QLD registered vehicle then said vehicle must comply with the local state rules. Remember SA P platers can drive V8s and turbos in NSW and up until recently QLD P platers did not need P plates on their cars even when interstate or could ride any motorcycle regardless of capacity if they had done Q-ride. It used to be common practice to register V8 converted cortinas and capris in NSW as it was illegal up here but interstate is exempt. 2) As I read it, if the suspension mods are done by an authorised person OR the components are factory or approved aftermarket components e.g. XR suspension on a XT or Bilstein coilover kit then and the difference is less than 51mm then there is no problem. On the other hand if the change is greater than 50mm OR it is a fully sick hacksaw job then it has to be investigated by an engineer. I agree with this totally. It is far to easy to totally stuff the dynamics of a vehicle in the name of uber-kewl-osity. You need an engineer to certify an engine change or other major modification and modern vehicles are quite complex with safety systems they rely on static parameters. Some vehicles can be modified by far more than 50mm and be perfectly safe, many cannot. You do not change your suspension every week so what is the problem? What this will (or at least should) reduce is the number of home brew fast and furious maccas dwellers who drift onto your side of the road on a tight corner because their tyres are skipping. |
||
20-07-2009, 03:20 PM | #107 | ||||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: NSW
Posts: 864
|
hmm
anyone with a stock BF xt want to measure the distance from center of wheel to top of guard for me? simmilarly anyone with a bf xt with optional sports suspension wanna do the same? and while im at it how about xr owners may i add Quote:
like thats not confusing Quote:
Last edited by Ross-b; 20-07-2009 at 03:28 PM. |
||||
20-07-2009, 03:49 PM | #108 | |||
He has, the Knack..
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 1,042
|
Quote:
I'm annoyed at being grouped into the "hoon" category, along with most people here. I have never had a speeding fine, in fact the only thing was an at-fault accident when I rear-ended a guy who stopped cold on the freeway in the right hand land and blew 0.04, and I lost a couple of points for it (fair enough, I copped it). I learnt from it and now back off further in the wet. I'm annoyed at having to have my car inspected, at my own cost and time, simply because it has been lowered an inch or so. I'm annoyed at the useless politicians in this state, who instead of trying to fix REAL problems prefer to look at the easy targets, bignoting themselves and giving the appearance of fixing a problem that was never previously an issue. I will be annoyed when I'm sure to be pulled over repeatedly over the next couple of months when they are enforcing this law. I know it won't be the officers fault, but I'm sure he will cop it from a number of motorists for just doing his job. I was considering buying a set of coil-overs and sway bars, but now I'm holding out for the moment to see where this is going, and I'm sure the company who's missing out on my $ is annoyed.
__________________
2010 BF MKIII Falcon wagon "EGO" Workhorse, stock as a rock 2004 BA MKI Futura - Now the wife's For Show: 18" Kaotic Shadow Chrome, King SL all round, Cadence Amp, Kenwood 12" Sub, JL Audio 5x7's, Scuff Plates, MP3 Connector For Go: SVI LPG, K&N Filter, F6 CAI, XR6T snorkle, XR8 catback, Magnaflow metal cat, Pacemaker headers, Underdrive, Thermostat, Custom tune, DBA4000 Now with baby seat and toys 175.6 rwkw www.bseries.com.au/King_Nothing |
|||
20-07-2009, 04:15 PM | #109 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 12,077
|
Fair enough, I just skirted through the doco. While I think I understand the principle they are trying to deliver I suspect, like most legislation created by "anti" lobby groups, the actual implementation needs to be improved.
Like the first round of P plate laws, Smart cars etc were banned while Porsches and M series BMWs were ok. But you have to remember this law like so many others only affects the idiots who voted the lawmakers into power...... |
||
20-07-2009, 04:28 PM | #110 | ||
Petro-sexual
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,527
|
They just complicated things un-necessarily to make it look like they were doing something against 'hoons', when in fact they made it worse initially, because they didnt look past their noses but stated that V8's and turbos are evil.
The old law of 125kw/tonne (or whatever it was) pretty much covered all bases. Sometimes the simplest explanations are the best. I hope this doesnt put undue pressure on the after market industries related to this. It's the last thing we need in this climate of all times. |
||
20-07-2009, 04:34 PM | #111 | ||
He has, the Knack..
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 1,042
|
Agree 100%, badly modified cars shouldn't be on the roads and I see your point in that respect. I sure as hell didn't vote these idiots in and it's affecting me.
The implementation has been terrible. There has been no consultation with stakeholders (The first Pedders heard about this was the same as the rest of us, I imagine every other aftermarket suspension manufacturer is the same). This isn't the only instance of this happening right now, the marine park debate in fishing circles is exactly the same thing. This is a real industry with real jobs that are being affected. As I have read previously this would be the bread and butter work for many of these places, fitting lowered springs that meet whatever standards are required. Now that is in jeapordy, purely because Mr Daley "thinks so". I had a look through the thread on the Pedders XA coilovers, and the manufacturing process involved, there is a significant investment there that would require a certain baseload of work (manufacturing springs) to meet costs. How will this rushed piece of legislation affect them? How many jobs could potentially be lost? And they have had NO WARNING. This government should be dealing with REAL PROBLEMS affecting EVERYBODY, like the recession, the woeful way in which swine flu is being handled in our hospitals (I know first hand!), public transport, housing affordability, homelessness, traffic congestion, crime, just to name a few. Not putting on useless band-aid solutions on problems that don't exist, and can cost people their jobs, in a recession, just so that the ACA cardigan brigade thinks the government is actually doing something.
__________________
2010 BF MKIII Falcon wagon "EGO" Workhorse, stock as a rock 2004 BA MKI Futura - Now the wife's For Show: 18" Kaotic Shadow Chrome, King SL all round, Cadence Amp, Kenwood 12" Sub, JL Audio 5x7's, Scuff Plates, MP3 Connector For Go: SVI LPG, K&N Filter, F6 CAI, XR6T snorkle, XR8 catback, Magnaflow metal cat, Pacemaker headers, Underdrive, Thermostat, Custom tune, DBA4000 Now with baby seat and toys 175.6 rwkw www.bseries.com.au/King_Nothing |
||
20-07-2009, 04:34 PM | #112 | |||
Mot Adv-NSW
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lake Macquarie, NSW
Posts: 2,153
|
Athol Mullen, engineer who does compliance stuff for submission to RTA calls Michael Daley's latest endeavour 'a can of worms'.
He's on Facebook, or at the aus.cars newsgroup. Some legal applicability issues will need to work their way through the courts. Quote:
__________________
ORDER FORD AUSTRALIA PART NO: AM6U7J19G329AA. This is a European-UN/AS3790B Spec safety-warning triangle used to give advanced warning to approaching traffic of a vehicle breakdown, or crash scene (to prevent secondary). Stow in the boot area. See your Ford dealer for this $35.95 safety item & when you buy a new Ford, please insist on it! See Page 83, part 4.4.1 http://www.transport.wa.gov.au/media...eSafePart4.pdf |
|||
20-07-2009, 04:38 PM | #113 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 14,654
|
Quote:
I followed a very low Falcon through a car park with 4 speed humps yesterday, 2 mins later after waiting for him to negotiate each speed hump sideways (while scraping his exhaust) at crawling pace we eventually go out of the car park, then he crawled out due to the exit angle of the driveway... surely it must be annoying as hell having a car so low in the first place?
__________________
335 S/C GT: The new KING of Australian made performance cars.. |
|||
20-07-2009, 04:42 PM | #114 | |||
He has, the Knack..
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 1,042
|
Quote:
Old rules 0-50mm - no certification required 50-150mm - engineering certificate required 150mm+ - illegal New rules 0-50mm - engineering certificate required 50mm+ - illegal I'd love to be wrong... Either way it still doesn't change the terrible way this has been handled, the confusion is inexcusible, and the time frame (2 weeks!!!) is pure insanity. How does he expect every single lowered or raised car in NSW to be engineered within 2 weeks?!
__________________
2010 BF MKIII Falcon wagon "EGO" Workhorse, stock as a rock 2004 BA MKI Futura - Now the wife's For Show: 18" Kaotic Shadow Chrome, King SL all round, Cadence Amp, Kenwood 12" Sub, JL Audio 5x7's, Scuff Plates, MP3 Connector For Go: SVI LPG, K&N Filter, F6 CAI, XR6T snorkle, XR8 catback, Magnaflow metal cat, Pacemaker headers, Underdrive, Thermostat, Custom tune, DBA4000 Now with baby seat and toys 175.6 rwkw www.bseries.com.au/King_Nothing |
|||
20-07-2009, 04:43 PM | #115 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: NSW
Posts: 864
|
Quote:
ive got ssl in the rear of mt xt where does that leave me? after the cash i spent on new shocks springs bump stops alignments and camber adjustments. have i really modified the car un safely? |
|||
20-07-2009, 04:55 PM | #116 | |||
He has, the Knack..
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 1,042
|
Quote:
__________________
2010 BF MKIII Falcon wagon "EGO" Workhorse, stock as a rock 2004 BA MKI Futura - Now the wife's For Show: 18" Kaotic Shadow Chrome, King SL all round, Cadence Amp, Kenwood 12" Sub, JL Audio 5x7's, Scuff Plates, MP3 Connector For Go: SVI LPG, K&N Filter, F6 CAI, XR6T snorkle, XR8 catback, Magnaflow metal cat, Pacemaker headers, Underdrive, Thermostat, Custom tune, DBA4000 Now with baby seat and toys 175.6 rwkw www.bseries.com.au/King_Nothing |
|||
20-07-2009, 04:57 PM | #117 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: NSW
Posts: 864
|
what do u think of this?
thats a b4 shot with a slice of the after showing the new distance from center of wheel to guard what are ur measurements (i presume still stock?) |
||
20-07-2009, 05:12 PM | #118 | ||
not here much anymore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Sthn NSW
Posts: 22,918
|
I am asking the same question as some here but I think this very thread highlights one of the major issues that this law now places on everybody who wants to modify a car - what is legal and what isnt, and what or how do you prove it?
In my own personal example my ute is at stock XR height - that's already lower than a normal Falcon. Now if I lower mine another 50mm all round, am I ok according to this law, and if so, how do I explain that to Constable Plod on the side of the Highway? I can guarantee now that most police around here will not even know what stock XR Falcon ride height is (that's not meant as a derogatory comment, rather in my experience it is actually true), so how can I, or do I even have to, persuade Mr Plod that my car is ok even though yes it has been lowered?
__________________
2024 F150 XLT
|
||
20-07-2009, 05:18 PM | #119 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: NSW
Posts: 864
|
Quote:
still remains the question of how to prove it was done before the date? should i call the rta and get it checked and signed off to prove it was done before? |
|||
20-07-2009, 05:20 PM | #120 | |||
not here much anymore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Sthn NSW
Posts: 22,918
|
Quote:
__________________
2024 F150 XLT
|
|||
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|