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03-01-2007, 03:14 PM | #31 | ||
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A blowers power delivery is generally more liniar than turbo.
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03-01-2007, 03:29 PM | #32 | ||
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either way, the original question was blower or exhaust, exhaust will cost well under 1k,extractors to tip, fourced induction, blower or turbo, you wont have much change from 10k after engineering and all. exhaurst, i'm guessing about 10kw gain, other options 100+kw gain
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03-01-2007, 03:33 PM | #33 | ||
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Its actually a really odd topic to be honest. The options are poles apart.
It would be like asking"should I colour code my mirrors... or get a full respray in a new colour?" The cost, results and effort differences really put the exhaust vs blower into such difference spheres of modification that its a case of "Do the exhaust if you have $1,000, do the blower if you have $10,000" as stockoau has said.
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03-01-2007, 03:37 PM | #34 | ||
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If you want to supercharge on a shoe string budget read this thread and have a laugh http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthr...c+supercharger
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03-01-2007, 03:43 PM | #35 | ||
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god, that thread just wont die :
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03-01-2007, 03:44 PM | #36 | |||
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Quote:
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The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT |
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03-01-2007, 03:51 PM | #37 | ||||
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Quote:
I could type it all out but Gunns posted something a year or so ago that explains it all pretty much. Quote:
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03-01-2007, 03:54 PM | #38 | ||
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this has been a pretty handy thread! good to see the pros and cons for both mods. especially for someone like me who is only very basically mechanically minded. all i know is a SC/Turbo makes cars go faster. But how fast do ya wanna go?
If you were looking into the options you'd hafe to ask more questions, "am i going foir the land speed record, or do i just want to be able to pull away at the lights a bit quicker next time there's a ricecooker pulled up beside me but don't necessarily Wwant to beat him??" IMO, get an exhaust anyways, then look at a forced induction route. but that's just me talking, and i once thought Aluminium and Aluminum were two different things... :P If you really want to go faster, Get a lick of Red Paint and always wind your windows up
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03-01-2007, 03:55 PM | #39 | ||
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My point is that a turbo does not rob as much power as a s/c. The difference is around 20% efficiency. So if we assume that the power a turbo robs is nil, then in comparison, a s/c robs 20%. For 7 psi for each, these figures may be 7% and 27%, but in relative terms, a s/c costs 20% more power than a turbo does, given the same psi rating etc.
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The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT |
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03-01-2007, 03:58 PM | #40 | ||
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I am leaning back towards the turbo now, as it's a cheaper setup, even if it does require more work to set up. I reckon for under $6k, I could get a snort stage 2 (~$4k) up and running, including exhaust changes (<$500) and edit (~$1500). The base s/c kit is more like $7k, and that still needs an edit, so the turbo kit saves roughly $2.5k. And gives around 80rwkw.
Back to the original question, do exhaust now, and start saving for either route of forced induction.
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The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT |
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03-01-2007, 04:00 PM | #41 | ||||
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I use a cobalt 27 turn motor to propel a 1.2 kg graphite RC car to... maybe 25 mph. Lol. They have around 200mm of torque! Somehow that kind of force doesnt equate in my mind to... 984cfm... pressurised! Quote:
This has a HUGE impact on the efficiency of these air pumps we call engines. Like a turbo, the amount of energy used to spin a blower depends on the boost... not an arbitrary figure of "x" %...
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03-01-2007, 04:02 PM | #42 | |||
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This is the opposite of a turbo. To start with the amount of psi you get back (lets say 7psi) will take around 14psi of exhaust pressure to generate. That equates to 14% on load. As the exhaust gasses increase the actual turbo "blockage" becomes significant too, far more than a standard set of extractors. As I said, its horses for courses and each has an application and a down side. Neither are "free" power.
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03-01-2007, 04:03 PM | #43 | ||
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i don't quite get what your on about as in perpetual motion, using exhaust to increase airflow, isnt perpetual motion. Your using the force of air from the exhaurst to spine a turbine to increase air intake. that is where there is a power loss, from the transfer of fource from the exhaurst to fource of induction. Considering the gasses expelled from the exhaurst arn't in use, you realy are not taking power from the engine to gain boost.
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03-01-2007, 04:10 PM | #44 | |||
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The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT |
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03-01-2007, 04:15 PM | #45 | |||
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An Engine is an airpump. A supercharger is another airpump, as is a turbo charger. They all do the same job in different ways. They all have different efficiencies and different characteristics to the way they work together and they way they effect engine power. No matter the method used, you lose some power, to gain some power. End of story.
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03-01-2007, 04:18 PM | #46 | |||
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03-01-2007, 04:23 PM | #47 | ||
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so what your saying, is there is no air pressure at the end of the extractors on a non turbo car? It dosn't take much but you really have me confused
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03-01-2007, 04:32 PM | #48 | |||
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N/A exhaust design is primarly based arround proviing low pressure at the valve face upon opening of the valve to aid in the pressure drop at the back of the valve face. Now say you pressurise the back of the valve with exhaust gas at xpsi above what would be seen with the N/A setup. The effective pressure drop accross the valve face is xpsi less than was achieved with the N/A setup, thus causing two things (1) increases the force the exhaust stroke expells to push the exhaust gas out of the cylinder (2) reuces the effect of valve overlap has on drawing in the next intake stroke.
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03-01-2007, 04:32 PM | #49 | |||
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03-01-2007, 04:37 PM | #50 | ||
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supercharger/turbo its all crap anyway, acourding to the link above the only way to go is get a pc fan
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03-01-2007, 04:43 PM | #51 | ||
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i suggest you buy two.
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03-01-2007, 04:50 PM | #52 | |||
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03-01-2007, 04:57 PM | #53 | |||
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03-01-2007, 05:01 PM | #54 | |||
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03-01-2007, 05:06 PM | #55 | |||
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03-01-2007, 05:09 PM | #56 | ||
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as i said pc fans, or does the current drawn cause extra drag through the alternator?
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03-01-2007, 05:10 PM | #57 | |||
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03-01-2007, 05:12 PM | #58 | |||
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03-01-2007, 05:12 PM | #59 | ||
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What a read
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03-01-2007, 05:12 PM | #60 | |||
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What’s the Efficiency of the PC fan? What’s the Efficiency of your alternator Does the gain cover the 30bhp loss for being ***edited***?
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