budget turbos

sfr rob · 23-10-2005, 09:12 PM

hey guys, i was wondering if turbo'ing my AU would be a good idea.
Can someone give me an in depth run down of what would be involved, and what the cost would roughly be?

I am not after something that will run 11's like dansedgl had going... but something tamer that will be reliable and will not be giving me problems all the time!

I am just weighing up what i want to do with the car... either get the performance up, or trade in for a V8, either AU or BA.
(or just admit to my self that my car is a rice burning 6 cyl piece of poo! LOL)

thanks fellas

ROB

EFFalcon · 23-10-2005, 09:16 PM

how much can you do yourself?
think near $10k to do it properly and reliably.

jonbays · 23-10-2005, 09:19 PM

$10k and issues with engineering certificates and insurance!

BA XR8's and XR6T' now under $30k so I would trade if I were you

Racecraft · 23-10-2005, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonbays

$10k and issues with engineering certificates and insurance!

BA XR8's and XR6T' now under $30k so I would trade if I were you

I agree to a degree but they are both still 14 second cars stock.. You still need to throw a few thousand dollars at the problem if you want to see 13's..

An AU with 7psi or so would pull a 13 standing on it head. It depends on if you want something a little custom or just another BA XR really.. Your car looks unique and sweet atm so I'd personally go for a custom kit to be a little different

sfr rob · 23-10-2005, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racecraft

I agree to a degree but they are both still 14 second cars stock.. You still need to throw a few thousand dollars at the problem if you want to see 13's..

An AU with 7psi or so would pull a 13 standing on it head. It depends on if you want something a little custom or just another BA XR really.. Your car looks unique and sweet atm so I'd personally go for a custom kit to be a little different

yeah i know what you mean, but i have ALWAYS wanted a V8.

I was hoping someone would say i could get my car running a turbo for under 5 grand.. then i would have considered it.
But with all the time money and effort doing that, its just not worth it i think!

b2tf · 23-10-2005, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfr rob

I was hoping someone would say i could get my car running a turbo for under 5 grand..

You can. But its the difference between having a good reliable car with a properly designed and constructed turbo system on there, or having an Ebay parts special that while it is turboed, spends more time off the road or needing more work to get more out of it.

The 2 words in this thread's title do not go with each other. IMHO if you want to do something like a turbo setup you need to be prepared to spend pretty much whatever it takes to reach your goal time/power with a proper setup. Many have tried doing it on the cheap and you can look on these very forums to see the results of doing it that way.

Its like anything really - if youre going to do it, do it properly, and to do that you need to be able to justify the cost involved to yourself. If you cant do it, then it's time look at other options which may include moving up to a model like XR6T.

IMHO XR6T is the best way to go for those who want reasonable, reliable power in a family sedan without going down the aftermarket route and spending $$$. Straight out BFYB.

SpoolMan · 23-10-2005, 09:19 PM

Go to ebay, type in ''FORD EA-AU STAGE 4'' nice looking starter kit for $3000 to $3500.

sfr rob · 23-10-2005, 09:25 PM

yeah, with that price tag on turbo, i think i might look at a trade in for an XR6t or XR8 in a couple of months..

the ebay stuff.... that cant be a right price yeah??
$3500.. thats just all the parts you need yeah? no computer chips, tuning etc?

EFFalcon · 23-10-2005, 09:29 PM

thats missing plenty of parts.

a few of the major ones are
intercooler, piping & ECU/Injectors.
those alone will bump the pricing up.
not to mention installation and other various small bits that add up in cost REAL quick

sfr rob · 23-10-2005, 09:32 PM

ok.
thanks for the info guys.

its just not worth spending that amount of cash on my car when it would only fetch $11,ooo or less if i was to sell it.
looks like next year my bum will be in a V8, ts50 or BA XR8.
i have made my mind up on that!

Cheers
thanks again guys
Rob

needfordspeed · 23-10-2005, 09:33 PM

For $3500 you'll probably get a turbo,manifold,wastegate and oil lines maybe even a cooler, contact a guy called 6BOOST on these forums, he'll help ya with turbo parts, he's prices are very reasonable for what you get too. On top of that $3500 you'll have to add money for exhaust, cooler piping, ECU, tuning etc etc it's not cheap but as EFFALCON said all up you'll be up for around $8 - $10K excluding engineeers cert.

needfordspeed · 23-10-2005, 09:36 PM

Damn 3 replies while I was typing my reply :P too slow!!

Racecraft: Although they are 14 second cars stock, with just an edit they will be WELL into the 13's, a custom edit is around $1300 IIRC.

sfr rob · 23-10-2005, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by needfordspeed

Damn 3 replies while I was typing my reply :P too slow!!

Racecraft: Although they are 14 second cars stock, with just an edit they will be WELL into the 13's, a custom edit is around $1300 IIRC.

yeah well with the results CHRIS from these forums is getting with his boss, 12's that is, it seems like a good thing to grab an XR8 for my next car.

JC · 23-10-2005, 11:12 PM

rob, your car +$5k, and you can have my AU1 XR8. It may not be the fire breathing monster that the BAs are, but in everyday driving, it doesn't lose out on much. In fact in a lot of ways it's better - especially when you are talking about exhaust note!

Mine does 0-100 in about 7.2, quarter in mid to high 14s, low 15s at the slowest. $5k is a cheap way into a V8. And yes, I am serious.

LG · 23-10-2005, 11:37 PM

My opinion...

AU + turbo
Ups: Hot, fast
Downs: $$$ in maintenance, in tyres, in speeding fines, in engineering and testing and other fines, and not to mention fuel

BA + turbo
Ups: Great car
Down: Lose money, selling and buying another car. You'll use more fuel.

How i see it, the AU has plenty of power, if your not in for the full drag scene. Your car looks mint as it is. So why get rid of it, and get another car that just looks the same as the other person's around the corner. Spend $2k on the AU's engine and get it up to about 130-140rwkw. And that'll be enough to blow most cars, and it'll still keep it's fuel economy. Anyway it's not like you can race on the streets, so you won't be able to use your xxx rwkw to it's full capacity. Then run the AU into the ground, and upgrade, then go big. But that's just me.

stiddy · 24-10-2005, 12:01 AM

10k will get you the complete turbo kit + install by a mechanic.. max is 3k labour so yeah.. and usually 7k can get you all the gear..
when i got my kit all together it cost $7,200 for everything but i wasnt looking around or anything i just grabbed what was there at the time (stupid move)..
AU + turbo = 13's no problems at all

EFFalcon · 24-10-2005, 12:04 AM

i wouldn't say 'no problems at all'
but 13's are easy taking if research is done before purchase.

RED_EL_XR8 · 24-10-2005, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EFFalcon

i wouldn't say 'no problems at all'
but 13's are easy taking if research is done before purchase.

Not exactly easy! There are many more on the high side of this number than there are below it. It's only easy once you have a glovebox full of sub 14 timeslips until then its speculation.

JC · 24-10-2005, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

Not exactly easy! There are many more on the high side of this number than there are below it. It's only easy once you have a glovebox full of sub 14 timeslips until then its speculation.

Red - that is gold! BTW it's you're, not your.

The Snort Performance setups are reasonable value for money. I looked seriously into their $3k setup, but rego authorities require an engineer's certificate, insurance just laughed at me (except Just cars and shannons, but I don't have $2k a year to burn on premiums), and the missus had only given me a budget of $2.5k. So I shelved that whole idea, and went for an XR front & bonnet instead. Rob, perhaps you should look into a real XR front, and get rid of that funny front bar on your car. LOL.

stiddy · 24-10-2005, 12:19 AM

sorry i should of added au 'XR6' + turbo = no problems at all hahaha
but seriously if research is done like effalcon said, and you dont take short cuts with the set up.. you will give your average v8's and ba xr6t's a good scare..

TURBOTAXI · 24-10-2005, 06:38 AM

I guess my car would be described as an Ebay parts special.
I dont know much about turbo's etc.... But you can do the lot under five.
I have read some comments regarding reliability. I think reliable needs to be defined. I think that how you drive a car has plenty to do with how long it lasts. Servicing is a variable too. I find my car to be "reliable", and cheap to run.
Here are the parts as they cost me.
$3000 Snort stage IV
$180 EBay intercooler
$600 Three inch Mandrel bend Ex
$150 2xGTR BOV's
$250 Vortech 12:1 Rising rate Regulator (for when I have no LPG)
$240 Clamps, intercooler piping, silicone hose etc....
$33 Alloy Catch can
$30 Speco Boost gauge
That totals out to $4483

The first time I fitted the kit it took me two days working on and off. I was groping in the dark to some extent. I kept coming back to this forum and asking questions.

When I changed the motor over recently I did the engine swap and refitted the trubo kit in 2.5 days of solid work. That included re-tapping the sump for the oil drain, changing over the engine harness, coils, TPS and throttle body.

If I can do it in the back yard with basic tools and the tractor jib to hoist the engine, a real mechanic should be able to do it heaps faster. 16 Hours @ $70 per hour is $1120.

I dont know what the output of the car is at the moment, I am adjusting LPG but it is faster than the old engine. Previously the car had 135 rwkw I know thats not much but it was endowed with great torque that made the car so driveable.

stiddy · 24-10-2005, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TURBOTAXI

I guess my car would be described as an Ebay parts special.
I dont know much about turbo's etc.... But you can do the lot under five.
I have read some comments regarding reliability. I think reliable needs to be defined. I think that how you drive a car has plenty to do with how long it lasts. Servicing is a variable too. I find my car to be "reliable", and cheap to run.
Here are the parts as they cost me.
$3000 Snort stage IV
$180 EBay intercooler
$600 Three inch Mandrel bend Ex
$150 2xGTR BOV's
$250 Vortech 12:1 Rising rate Regulator (for when I have no LPG)
$240 Clamps, intercooler piping, silicone hose etc....
$33 Alloy Catch can
$30 Speco Boost gauge
That totals out to $4483

The first time I fitted the kit it took me two days working on and off. I was groping in the dark to some extent. I kept coming back to this forum and asking questions.

When I changed the motor over recently I did the engine swap and refitted the trubo kit in 2.5 days of solid work. That included re-tapping the sump for the oil drain, changing over the engine harness, coils, TPS and throttle body.

If I can do it in the back yard with basic tools and the tractor jib to hoist the engine, a real mechanic should be able to do it heaps faster. 16 Hours @ $70 per hour is $1120.

I dont know what the output of the car is at the moment, I am adjusting LPG but it is faster than the old engine. Previously the car had 135 rwkw I know thats not much but it was endowed with great torque that made the car so driveable.

$4,483 for some of the kit, what about fuel pump, injectors and ems?
add an easy $2,000 - $2,500 to that $4,483.. and then dyno time?
without these parts your severly limiting the output your car can make, i think 135rwkw shows that..

a real mechanic would probably take just aslong if not longer.. not knocking your approach to the set up but drilling a hole in an AU sump to tap a thread without actually removing the sump and putting a nut on the inside, and stopping metal shavings falling in.. isnt exactly the right way to go about it..
(Joe from Cresent told me the above) and i tend to agree with him.

yes you can build a turbo system on a small budget to a certain degree, but dont expect anything fantastic out of it, and 4k just simply isnt enough..

when i was doing mine i got quote for getting it all installed and labour started from about $2200 - $3000 and that was speaking with over 5 reputable mechanics..

TURBOTAXI · 25-10-2005, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiddy

$4,483 for some of the kit, what about fuel pump, injectors and ems?
add an easy $2,000 - $2,500 to that $4,483.. and then dyno time?
without these parts your severly limiting the output your car can make, i think 135rwkw shows that..

a real mechanic would probably take just aslong if not longer.. not knocking your approach to the set up but drilling a hole in an AU sump to tap a thread without actually removing the sump and putting a nut on the inside, and stopping metal shavings falling in.. isnt exactly the right way to go about it..
(Joe from Cresent told me the above) and i tend to agree with him.

yes you can build a turbo system on a small budget to a certain degree, but dont expect anything fantastic out of it, and 4k just simply isnt enough..

when i was doing mine i got quote for getting it all installed and labour started from about $2200 - $3000 and that was speaking with over 5 reputable mechanics..

I soke with Joe about this too. I know that is what he likes to do. I am not saying that is right or wrong - for a super high horsepower application that might be better. The TSA kit for E-Series (I dont think they have an alloy sump) used a punch to flare the metal so it could be threaded. The truth is that there is no load whatsoever on the oil return line, and 3-4 good threads will hold it there for eternity - well that is what I think. Regarding the metal filings, I used a heavy grease and kept removing the drill/tap and reapplying the grease. I know when I pulled the old motor out there was no play whatsoever in the oil return line. Have you seen how thick the alloy sump off an AU is?

My dyno tuning cost $40 - I didnt include that. LPG with a max flow adjuster does not take long to tune. - Screw goes in screw goes out. My LPG system runs independantly of the ECU and responds only to manifold vacuum/pressure to meter fueling.

I dont know if you realise but my car runs LPG through a standard ring mixer, my car was not running an intercooler for the 135rwkw meaning anything over half throttle at operating temperature would lead to detonation.The engine had something like 300,000 k's on it. I also get 500k's+ to a tank of LPG ($35) If this is another by product of only 135rwkw - I like it.

The AU fuel pump is capable of about 4 BAR of pressure, and a 12:1 rising rate regulator (note NOT a 2:1) gives me more fuel than the engine can deal with. I spend 95% of my time on LPG anyway and have not pursued the development of regular fueling beyond the rising rate reg.

For the record I had a discussion with a mechanic who said he would swap the engine and refitt the turbo etc... for $1200.

There are a number of ways to skin a cat, and I think the approach depends on what you want to acheive. I wanted a car that was cheap to run, but had a bit of poke when I put my foot down I commute 160k's per day and regulalrly hit emu's and roo's. It is not an option where I live to drive around the corner to the high performance shop and have work done. I would rather do it myself so if things go wrong I know how to rectify it. You might be after something different with your car and I hope you acheive what you want.

loxxr6 · 24-10-2005, 02:42 PM

Quote:

its just not worth spending that amount of cash on my car when it would only fetch $11,ooo or less if i was to sell it.

Exactly, but you're not exactly spending money to do it just for the aim of selling the car are you ?

I considered trading up to a BA XR6T but thought stuff it - it also didn't help they're still a bit out of reach too - I blame having two mortgages for this.

However, I like my AU and the thought of having something a bit different was more appealing. Bring on the boost....and for most people being taken out by an AU (of all model falcons) would be really horrible.

Casper · 24-10-2005, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loxxr6

....and for most people being taken out by an AU (of all model falcons) would be really horrible.

Especially said BA XR6T owners bwahahahhahaa. I'm with you Loxx.

Mr Cube · 24-10-2005, 04:03 PM

I considered the trade up... I like the technology of the BA, but not the look XR6.. I like the AU cause you know its a XR just by a quick look.. The BA you got to have a good look...

I have been out talking to the guys here in Canberra and they rekon bout $9000, all parts, custom tune, new exhaust, fabrication of some parts.

Was thinking of putting in a BA6T engine, could get all the parts from FernTree for $7.5K, but the conversion work on top was going to put it way over the $10K, couldn't even give me a good idea of the cost..

Anyways got the missus pumped about the idea so just got the saving part now.

So many plans so little money, my respray project is off for the time being as I can't decide what colour pearl to put over. So just going to touch up the Galaxy..

JC · 24-10-2005, 04:54 PM

Cubey - you better get the work done soon. Once there are 3 of you, every mod becomes a case of having to justify it. The XR front for the wagon, for example, came about because I had a blown RH headlight bulb. j/k, but you get the idea.

Mr Cube · 24-10-2005, 05:04 PM

LOL, thats how I got the brakes done.. Has to be safe for when the baby is in the car ;)

Main problem was when I was telling Jacq about the turbo, her call was wonder if they would do a better deal if we got 2 done.. Sometimes I wish she still had the excel;)

dansedgli · 25-10-2005, 07:58 AM

GT34540 turbo, custom manifold, tial wastegate- $3300 off 6BOOST.
Water and Oil Lines- $200
Intercooler $200 off ebay.
Intercooler piping- $600ish
Exhaust- $600ish
Injectors- $360 off 6BOOST if he still does them.
walbro fuel pump - $160
ECU- $1200 for a wolf. +tuning.

Total= $6620 plus tuning. Not including labour to fit the cooler, turbo, manifold.

Then there is extras like boost guages and blow off valves, boost controllers etc.

It can be done. My EB cost me around $8500 including all the bolt ons and everything I needed to run over 300rwkw minus the engine and driveline. But I paid through the teeth for labour and the majority of the things I could have done myself. I also paid $1200 for a set of injectors which is way more expensive than what I should have spent.

Even on my torana project I have only spent about $7000 and pretty much have everything I need to get the engine boosted. Most of my parts were sourced off 6BOOST. I bought a rajab plenum, injectors, fuel pump, custom fuel rail, GT3540, wastegate, manifold, decomp plate and injectors from him for around $5500, the cooler is off ebay for $180, I got the wolf ECU for $1200 a few weeks ago.

All I need is cooler piping, an exhaust and fitting of the ECU and tuning and Im set.

PS. If it was me I would keep it stock :P Its not worth the risk in Vic. Especially if your not keen to pull everything off yourself when you get defected.
Sell it and buy a skyline. More performance, more legal etc. Not that much more expensive than your AU now either. $1500 on top of the purchase price will put you well into the 13's too.

Mr Cube · 25-10-2005, 08:43 AM

Dan, when did you sell the AU??? I don't remember seeing a post about it